Posts belonging to Category 'largemouth bass'

West Nile Spraying In largemouth bass photos Central Park Tonight. Will it kill the fish ?

Question:

I meant to offend no one with my remark,largemouth bass photos which was aimed at the Classic only. I believe that humor can help lessen or even heal many ills, just as I believe over-sensitivity and over-defensiveness may be the most dangerous malady we face as a growing population. My remark was prompted simply by the reference made in the original post to fishing in Central Park, which until then I didn’t know really existed.

Why not?largemouth bass photos  I fish a lot of waters in highly populated, developed areas, and anytime I fish where lots of people pass by, I always get questions like, “Are there actually any fish in there?”.  Sometimes I like to say, “Of course; who told you there were no fish in there?”. I don’t know what the waters are like in the cities closest to where you live, but here in NYC and it’s environs, just about every permanent body of largemouth bass photos fresh water has a largemouth bass population (as well as bullheads, suckers, sunfish, and yellow perch).

Response:

No offense was taken. and there us great fishing in Central Park. Lake Prospect Anglers largemouth bass photos I meant to offend no one with my remark, which was aimed at the Classic only. I believe that humor can help lessen or even heal many ills, just as I believe over-sensitivity and over-defensiveness may be the most dangerous malady we face as a growing population. My remark was prompted simply by the reference made in the original post to fishing in Central Park, which until then I didn’t know really existed. — ~Bob Rickard Vote early and often this November; the country you save may be your own. Bob,   This really is not a laughing matter that needs a wise a__ answer this deadly virus is called West Nile like esephalitus is  spread by mosquitos and birds, it is spreading rapidly to the north of the city and has moved as far north now as Orange County NY in the Hudson Valley and is expected to possibly make it as far this year as the northern Catskill Region and maybe as far west as the Poconos in PA.    The pesticide they sprayed last year in NYC was about as bad as the virus in its health effects and it did kill some fish. This year they are trying a new pesticide that is said to be safer.    This may not effect you now but in the future if it does would you want some perch jerker making jokes about it.

Response:

problem with such a Classic being held in Central and other NYC Parks is that I am told that the NYC P&R Commish is not a big fan of sihing,as per my local State D.E.C. official this past Friday. cheers to all. largemouth bass photos — Lake Prospect Anglers – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He can speak for himself, but it was obvious to me that Bob was making a joke about where the next Bassmaster’s Classic will be held, not the environmental damage that might be caused by pesticides or the danger to anglers or their quarry. —    Go Fishing.  And may your fish be as big as your tales.    Columbia, SC  Lake Murray Bob,   This really is not a laughing matter that needs a wise a__ answer this deadly virus is called West Nile like esephalitus is  spread by mosquitos and birds, it is spreading rapidly to the north of the city and has moved as far north now as Orange County NY in the Hudson Valley and is expected to possibly make it as far this year as the northern Catskill Region and maybe as far west as the Poconos in PA.    The pesticide they sprayed last year in NYC was about as bad as the virus in its health effects and it did kill some fish. This year they are trying a new pesticide that is said to be safer.    This may not effect you now but in the future if it does would you want some perch jerker making jokes about it. — Scott E. BASSINinNY’s Fishing Orange County NY http://here.at/bassininny Darn! This could affect next year’s Classic.

Response:

Today the City of NY said it must immediatley spray Central Park tonight, cause they found bugs carrying the virus (they claim). I have just spoken to some anglers on the phone who wonder if it will affect the fish in the Park Lake and Harlem Meer. We believe (like last year) that they will eventually end up spraying all the City Parks. last summer when they did, fishing slow downed greatly in Central Park, Clove Lakes, Wolfes Pond, Prospect and Van Courtlandt. keep your fingers crossed ladies and gents. cause if this stuff pollutes the City Lakes and Ponds and kills the fish, time for we NYC Anglers to take a stand and go on Tv/Radio,and to the NYS D.E.C.. TIGHT LINES. Mike,Lake Prospect Anglers.

Response:

Darn! This could affect next year’s Classic. — ~Bob Rickard Vote early and often this November; the country you save may be your own.

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Today the City of NY said it must immediatley spray Central Park tonight, cause they found bugs carrying the virus (they claim). I have just spoken to some anglers on the phone who wonder if it will affect the fish in the Park Lake and Harlem Meer. We believe (like last year) that they will eventually end up spraying all the City Parks. last summer when they did, fishing slow downed greatly in Central Park, Clove Lakes, Wolfes Pond, Prospect and Van Courtlandt. keep your fingers crossed ladies and gents. cause if this stuff pollutes the City Lakes and Ponds and kills the fish, time for we NYC Anglers to take a stand and go on Tv/Radio,and to the NYS D.E.C.. TIGHT LINES. Mike,Lake Prospect Anglers.

Response:

Bob,   This really is not a laughing matter that needs a wise a__ answer this deadly virus is called West Nile like esephalitus is  spread by mosquitos and birds, it is spreading rapidly to the north of the city and has moved as far north now as Orange County NY in the Hudson Valley and is expected to possibly make it as far this year as the northern Catskill Region and maybe as far west as the Poconos in PA.    The pesticide they sprayed last year in NYC was about as bad as the virus in its health effects and it did kill some fish. This year they are trying a new pesticide that is said to be safer.    This may not effect you now but in the future if it does would you want some perch jerker making jokes about it. — Scott E. BASSINinNY’s Fishing Orange County NY http://here.at/bassininny – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Darn! This could affect next year’s Classic.

Response:

Scott, question, how does the virus affect people, and how many folks are being affected?  Hopefully the new pesticide will kill the bugs and not the fishes, other wild life or people. I’m sure Bob didn’t mean to sound insensitive.  Sure it is a serious problem, but sometimes not being directly involved with something, it doesn’t have the same impact.  I don’t know Bob, but I don’t believe for a second that he or anyone in this NG would find it humorous that this virus is affecting people.  If it had been a rotenone spill, everyone might have found his joke easier to take, even you. I hate to think that we can’t see the humor in Bob’s joke, without thinking that Bob, or anyone else for that matter, would want even a single person to suffer from this virus. Bassman Duane Knight

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bob,   This really is not a laughing matter that needs a wise a__ answer this deadly virus is called West Nile like esephalitus is  spread by mosquitos and birds, it is spreading rapidly to the north of the city and has moved as far north now as Orange County NY in the Hudson Valley and is expected to possibly make it as far this year as the northern Catskill Region and maybe as far west as the Poconos in PA.    The pesticide they sprayed last year in NYC was about as bad as the virus in its health effects and it did kill some fish. This year they are trying a new pesticide that is said to be safer.    This may not effect you now but in the future if it does would you want some perch jerker making jokes about it. — Scott E. BASSINinNY’s Fishing Orange County NY http://here.at/bassininny Darn! This could affect next year’s Classic.

Response:

how does the virus affect people,

It usually kills them. As in dead. RichZ

Any bass fisherman in Wa?largemouth bass sketches

Question:

Dan, if you live in Van, why don’t you try the okanagan? Osoyoos lake has large and small mouth. largemouth bass sketches  Vaseaux lake has large to a reported 12 lbs!!, and it’s only 20 min from osoyoos. I am from Rossland B.C. and I fish at Duck lake near Creston. I have caught them to 8 lbs in this lake. Since you already have a B.C. license, why don’t you make the 4 hr drive to the okanagan? If you would like to fish Duck lake,largemouth bass sketches let me know and i’ll steer you straight.

I’ve heard abut the largemouth lakes in the Okanogan but thats a little far for me for day trips. I prefer to throw all my stuff in the trunk and head out at a moments notice largemouth bass sketches NW Washington is close enough for that.  I will probably make a trip out to the Okanagan for a couple days this summer though. I’ll email you for some tips if I do

Response:

Dan, There are some good smaller lakes in North Skagit and Whatcom counties that would be suited for tubin’.  Try Lizard and Palmer for starters.  Also, a larger lake, Whatcom, is GREAT for smallies.largemouth bass sketches I used to live up north there but its been awhile. Grab a local map for additional lakes. Good luck this season!

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largemouth bass sketches if you live in Van, why don’t you try the okanagan? Osoyoos lake has large and small mouth. Vaseaux lake has large to a reported 12 lbs!!, and it’s only 20 min from osoyoos. I am from Rossland B.C. and I fish at Duck lake near Creston. I have caught them to 8 lbs in this lake. Since you already have a B.C. license, why don’t you make the 4 hr drive to the okanagan? If you would like to fish Duck lake, let me know and i’ll steer you straight.largemouth bass sketches  Try Lake Terrell near Bellingham, its a small shallow weedy lake that warms quickly in spring and has some big largemouth bass. Oky777 You bet there are bassers in Wa!  Come visit our site at http://members.xoom.com/keypenbass/homepage.htm E-mail me and let me know the areas in Wa you fish. Look forward to hearing from you and trading info this season! I’m just in Vancouver BC and I’d like to try some bass fishing in NorthWest Washington. We have some good smallmouth lakes here but they are all on Vancouver Island and each trip costs me at least $70 in ferry fees =:O Can you (or anyone) recommend some lakes in Wa (especially the NW) thats getting some recent action?? I fish from a float tube so smaller sized lakes would be nice. Dan

Response:

Any bass fisherman in Wa?

Yep, I’m just south of Olympia.

Response:

You bet there are bassers in Wa!  Come visit our site at http://members.xoom.com/keypenbass/homepage.htm E-mail me and let me know the areas in Wa you fish. Look forward to hearing from you and trading info this season!

Response:

Try Lake Terrell near Bellingham, its a small shallow weedy lake that warms quickly in spring and has some big largemouth bass. Oky777

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You bet there are bassers in Wa!  Come visit our site at http://members.xoom.com/keypenbass/homepage.htm E-mail me and let me know the areas in Wa you fish. Look forward to hearing from you and trading info this season! I’m just in Vancouver BC and I’d like to try some bass fishing in NorthWest Washington. We have some good smallmouth lakes here but they are all on Vancouver Island and each trip costs me at least $70 in ferry fees =:O Can you (or anyone) recommend some lakes in Wa (especially the NW) thats getting some recent action?? I fish from a float tube so smaller sized lakes would be nice. Dan

Response:

Any bass fisherman in Wa?

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Price for Butterfly Koi world largemouth bass

Question:

Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp.world largemouth bass It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long.world largemouth bass What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Response:

Was it silver (gin) or platinum (white) Ogon (solid color) ? It really depends on where you are, here on Canada’s west coast you could expect to pay about $200 depending on quality, show koi going for thousands. If you really love it then pay what you think it’s worth to you.world largemouth bass Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Response:

I was given one “similar” to this and the same size… they called it a ghost koi and the retail price was $125.00.  I bought a real small one later on for $10.00.world largemouth bass .   “It’s not hard to meet expenses; they’re everywhere.” Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp.

The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinionworld largemouth bass  would be a fair price on a Koi like this?

Response:

In Missouri you can pay as much as $10.00 per inch.  Sometimes more depending on type of koi and you will be lucky to find butterfly koi this year here. VJ –

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Response:

The short answer seems, if the price is good for you then that’s all that matters.  Otherwise, could you tell us what they’re asking for the fish. That would give a better ballpark figure to know if you are being gouged or not.  I will agree that if the fish is as pretty as you say $100 is not outrageous. — Todo  —  North Florida Koi Club,

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Response:

Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Bill:  It is just how much you want the fish.  I have to watch my pennies (old guy on a fixed income you know :-) ), so I figure I can earn $50 to $100 by buying a small quality fish and growing it to the size you mention in a year. vern — Visit my Ponds at:   HTTP://www.webpak.net/~vrolson

Response:

Thanks, you all made me feel better of my purchase, I wasn’t sure if I did good or not!! I’m new at this, so I really appreciate the help. I guess you can tell I don’t know my “Koi Kolors”! As D/E van Ryswyk pointed out the color is a Platinum (Pure White), with very long flowing fins, all in  good shape. Now the weird part of the story starts! I had been to the nursery about a month ago, and first seen the this Koi. I had just left a fish store where they had 2 Koi just like this one for sale as a pair for $60.00, but they were about 2 1/2″ long. I asked the girl taking care of the fish, if that fish was for sale, and she said “No, because the fish in that pond are to hard to catch.” I left it at that, because the other store had the smaller ones, if I really wanted one that bad. Yesterday my cousin and I were driving around, and being that he also has a new pond, I wanted to show him the two Koi at the store, and I was thinking to myself that I might talk him into splitting the pair with me if he really liked them. Well of course the two were gone, so I took him over to the nursery to show him the big one. On the way I was thinking that being the end of the season, maybe they would make the effort to catch this fish, and sell it to me. When we got there, there was a different girl doing the pond stuff, so I asked her if the Koi in the front pond were for sale. The answer I got was,”Well I was told no by the other girl, but I think her opinion is biased, so I’ll go ask the owner.” She came back and said “yes, they are for sale, any fish in the pond for  $49.95″. Well after almost ripping the back pocket off my pants, trying to get to my wallet, (of course keeping my composure at all times!) I told her that the one I wanted was the White Butterfly Koi. she went and got two nets, and in about 10 min. it was in the bag (so to speak!) When we walked into the main store part of the nursery, you should have seen the heads turn! All the other sales girls were telling her that that Koi was not for sale! Then one of them said “none of the fish in that pond are for sale, ESPECIALLY THAT ONE !!” (well I thought the jig was up, and there was a large tear forming in me eye.) The sales girl replied that she had asked the owner, and even asked if he was sure, and he ok’ed the sale. Well we almost burned rubber leaving the place, and I’m hoping that other sales girl, that usually takes care of the fish at the nursery, is not lurking in my yard at night with a net, and a gun!! But I got the Koi for 49.99, and he seams very happy in my pond!!  Thanks again for the help. Bill Gunn      P.S. I wonder if she reads this news group!

Response:

Thanks, you all made me feel better of my purchase, I wasn’t sure if I did good or not!!

<snip  But I got the Koi for 49.99, and he seams very happy in my pond!!  Thanks again for the help. Bill Gunn      P.S. I wonder if she reads this news group!

that was cheaper than wholesale cost on a fish/type that size :) —  Ken Arnold,  ICQ # 1028648  KenCo Fish & Supplies  Pond and Aquarium fish,  Shipping plants/fish etc. a specialty    Imported & domestic Koi,Goldfish,Orandas,  Tropicals,exotics, Piranhas etc.

Response:

I recently bought a yellow butterfly with very little black shading -17 inches long for $200 at a retail store here in Santa Cruz, CA. Got tired of lurking! — Barry

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Response:

Barry, tired of lurking, wrote ~~I recently bought a yellow butterfly with very little black shading -17 inches long for $200 at a retail store here in Santa Cruz, CA. ~~ Hi Barry! Welcome to rec.ponds! Every once in a while I get an attack of koi envy and your new butterfly did it. Sounds like a loverly fish. k30 and the water gardening labradors REC.PONDS INFORMAL FAQ PAGE http://hometown.aol.com/k30a/myhomepage/writing.html

Response:

Hi Barry, welcome to the group. Tell us about your pond and fish….   :o ) —  Carol…   “Jury: Twelve people who determine which client has the better attorney.” – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Got tired of lurking!

Response:

Prices for Koi at Local Breeder, seems to charge the same for Butterfly Koi, these prices are approximate, but very close. Once they hit 12″ the price skyrockets! 10 to 24″……I don’t know, never seen one priced at this breeder of this size.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Prices for Koi at Local Breeder, seems to charge the same for Butterfly Koi, these prices are approximate, but very close. Once they hit 12″ the price skyrockets! 10 to 24″……I don’t know, never seen one priced at this breeder of this size.

If yall are buying “Butterfly Koi”, you’re getting ripped off even if you are getting $10 to take the fish away. Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph. Brett

Response:

Last week I was at Petsmart and saw the a gorgeous butterfly koi–all shiny bright yellow with black trim, about 5 inches long for 3 bucks.

The Petsmart in my area also carries koi for $1.99 and up.  I bought 6 3″ koi last spring ($1.99 each) and they are now beautiful fish.  A few are metallic orange and some are yellow, one is bluish,… some have sparkle/diamond scales, one doesn’t… what beauties!   The 5″ koi they were selling were $9.99 and they had a few real nice one’s about 8″ that were $69.99.  There were not butterfly koi though. I found really choice butterfly koi at the Aquatic Critter in Nashville for $5.99 and up.  This is all colors too, and all sizes.  I bought a bunch of them.  :o) —  Carol…   “The only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth.” – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Response:

Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph.

WHAT?  Are ye daft?  They’re beautiful with those long flowing fins, they’re so graceful, so ethereal…. and they come in so many colors. —  Carol…  likes all koi…. and GF…. “The only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth.”

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Koi for money? I partake in the Jan Jordan Fish Adoption program. k30 and the water gardening labradors REC.PONDS INFORMAL FAQ PAGE http://hometown.aol.com/k30a/myhomepage/writing.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Prices for Koi at Local Breeder, seems to charge the same for Butterfly Koi, these prices are approximate, but very close. Once they hit 12″ the price skyrockets! 10 to 24″……I don’t know, never seen one priced at this breeder of this size.  If yall are buying “Butterfly Koi”, you’re getting ripped off even if you

are getting $10 to take the fish away. Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph. Brett

NO way…. I know what I like and I like butterfly koi….. they are prettier and showier.. vj

Response:

Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph. WHAT?  Are ye daft?  They’re beautiful with those long flowing fins, they’re so graceful, so ethereal…. and they come in so many colors. — Carol…  likes all koi…. and GF…. “The only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth.”

They are deformed and fly in the face of true animal breeding tenets.  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.  Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. The “breed anything for money” mentality doesn’t work well in horses, dogs, or fish.   OTOH, I have seen one or two longfins that were atractive in thier own way.  But, they are not koi.  Koi do not have long fins.  They have thier place in the ornamental fish world, and are even beginning to show up with thier own category in koi shows.  However, I’ve seen time and again, a longfin disqualified and not be judged as a koi, because it is not one. I’ve even had to be a longfin judge in the past at fish shows because most certified judges will not judge them.   I know they are popular in the US.  In Japan, even the breeder that did the most to develop the breed has given up and sold his breeding stock a few years back.  As far as I know, most longfins are now only bred in the US where there seems to be a strong market.   You won’t find any coming from my farm.  I must admit, though, I have been experimenting with “normal” koi out of longfin lineage as breeding stock for stronger koi.  Longfins are tough and grow fast and big, all good qualities which would be a benefit in koi.  I’ve not been doing it long enough to see if it might be working.   Brett

Response:

Brett knows a lot about Koi breeding, as the folks in this group are well aware of . To ridicule someone about text wrapping is irrelevant , and tells everybody you just figured it out.            Vince GMT):  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.  Propogating

physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Obviously, you know little about breeding (or how to keep lines to < 79 chars, at most (heh-heh)  Corne1 Huth  -  http://40th.com/  Bullet database engines/servers 3.1  Win32-WinCE-OS2-Linux+

Response:

By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.  Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition

(for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. Obviously, you know little about breeding (or how to keep lines to < 79 chars, at most).  Breeders only care about what sells, that’s the way it is, and in-breeding gets you what in-breeding gets you.  My butterfly koi are kool koi.  My BK are tough koi.  BK probably aren’t what you sell, so it’s easy (and in your best interest) to poo-poo BK. (heh-heh) Corne1 Huth  -  http://40th.com/ Bullet database engines/servers 3.1  Win32-WinCE-OS2-Linux+

I have only been a fish breeder.  During the last 20 or so years, I’ve bred about 60 species and hybrids of fishes and invertebrates commercially.  During that entire time, I’ve practiced sound breeding and worked to improve the breed as well as make it profitable.  This has been the case with channel catfish for the table, largemouth bass for the fishing lake, and koi for the back yard pool.   Each operation in which I was the person responsible for breeding fish for whatever purpose has a record of my attempts to improve the breed for its intended use. My outbred strain of channel catfish grew quickly, had an excellent dress out percentage, and was resistant to poor water quality and disease.  For five years, I bred and stocked over 35 million channel catfish each year.  I used selected stock from nine states, including strains from private, state and federal sources.  The problems associated with breeding such huge numbers of animals is staggering.  In the 40 or so years of the catfish business in the US, catfish producers (not breeders) have managed to breed strains that are susceptible to every known disease, have as many as 15 extra fins, have heads 40% bigger than normal, and even cannot be caught with a seine.  Fish breeding by default instead of by design.   For the last decade or so, I’ve been breeding a “more catchable” strain of largemouth bass.  Catchability is a trait in bass as well as in catfish.  The trait is catchability and does not require inbreeding to bring it about.  More catchable bass are better suited to the purpose. And a buncha other stuff, like blue catfish, and hybrid buffalo fish, and coppernose bluegills, and threadfin shad, and tilapia, and …. Anyhow, your point is well taken, I don’t breed longfins and don’t care for them.  I do breed and sell. I don’t only care about “what sells”.  I could make a great deal more money by converting about half of my facility into longfin production. A pond grade longfin sells for 300% more than a pond grade koi and is about the same cost to produce.  There is a much bigger market for longfins in the US.  If I were really only interested in breeding what sells, I’d be breeding only longfins.  I wouldn’t have to compete with highly bred animals from 100 year old breeding farms.  It would be ever so much less difficult for me with respect to finances.  A feller from Texas doesn’t have to be Japanese to sell his longfin fish. Anybody can get a couple of longfins and raise a batch that will sell without having to sort and throw away most of the offspring.  No judges out there setting standards, no large population of stunning individuals with which to compete, a much less difficult landscape than that for a Texas koi breeder.  If it were only for the money, I’d have a farm full of longfins. But of course, I don’t know much about breeding, though. Brett

Response:

Dont dis my fish!!!  Ingrid List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List for care of goldfish go to http://puregold.aquaria.net/

I dont understand how someone can push Dandys fish and keep mutts ;P couldnt resist….. —  Ken Arnold,  ICQ # 1028648  KenCo Fish & Supplies  Pond and Aquarium fish,  Shipping plants/fish etc. a specialty    Imported & domestic Koi,Goldfish,Orandas,  Tropicals,exotics, Piranhas etc.

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But of course, I don’t know much about breeding, though. Meant breeders, but okay, if you say so. Corne1 Huth  -  http://40th.com/ Bullet database engines/servers 3.1  Win32-WinCE-OS2-Linux+

Makes more sense to me now.  In that context, you are sadly correct in (most) of your assumptions. Brett

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They are deformed and fly in the face of true animal breeding

tenets.  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.

*** What do you mean exactly by deformed as it’s only the fins that are elongated.   Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. *** I agree.  Some GF are so deformed (body and fins) that they look like freaks and surely are a burden to themselves.   The “breed anything for money” mentality doesn’t work well in horses,

dogs, or fish.   *** It must work… look at all the dog breeds – talk about deformities!  And the breeders find buyers. OTOH, I have seen one or two longfins that were atractive in thier

own way.  But, they are not koi.  Koi do not have long fins.

*** If they’re not koi what are they?  They look like koi except for the fins.  Aren’t they a cross between the long finned carp and the koi?   Aren’t they fertile? They have thier place in the ornamental fish world, and are even beginning to show up with thier own category in koi shows.  However, I’ve seen time and again, a longfin disqualified and

not be judged as a koi, because it is not one. *** I see.  But to those of us not interested in shows or $5,000.00 koi for our ponds they are quite beautiful.  Speaking only for myself, I like to watch them swim around my ponds. I’ve even had to be a longfin judge in the past at fish shows because

most certified judges will not judge them.   *** Why?  Couldn’t be “snobbery” could it?   :O) I know they are popular in the US.

*** They’re VERY popular here in TN.  In Japan, even the breeder that did the most to develop the breed has given up and sold his breeding stock a few years back.  As far as I know, most longfins

are now only bred in the US where there seems to be a strong market.

***  Probably a market among the non show crowd such as myself, where health and beauty come before “what wins at the shows.” You won’t find any coming from my farm.

***  You’re in business… us every day ponders are not. I must admit, though, I have been experimenting with “normal” koi out of longfin lineage as breeding stock for stronger koi.

*** Sounds good… you’re adding new genes.  Longfins are tough and grow fast and big, all good qualities which would be a benefit in koi.  I’ve not been doing it long enough to see if it

might be working.   ***  I also like the BF’s slimmer build as it makes them appear even more graceful and elegant.  The quality I’ve seen this year far surpasses what was avalible even 2 years ago. —  Carol…   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Brett

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If you waited to adopt BF koi here you better plan to live a few hundred years. —  Carol…   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Koi for money? I partake in the Jan Jordan Fish Adoption program.

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They are deformed and fly in the face of true animal breeding tenets.  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.   *** What do you mean exactly by deformed as it’s only the fins that are elongated.

That is a deformity.  You would not find such an animal surviving outside of captivity.   Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me). I feel very much the same about goldfish. *** I agree.  Some GF are so deformed (body and fins) that they look like freaks and surely are a burden to themselves.

They are. I like goldfish even less than longfins, with the exception of sarassa comets.  I find them very attractive. The “breed anything for money” mentality doesn’t work well in horses, dogs, or fish.   *** It must work… look at all the dog breeds – talk about deformities!  And the breeders find buyers.

You’re right, it works well with respect to finances, not with respect to biology.  How long is a “papillon” going to live outside of a climate controlled kennel (or home) without a highly regulated diet?  Same is true for those “bulbous eyed” goldfish.  The first osprey that comes along is going to have a hard choice between them.  Probly catch and eat both in the same day. OTOH, I have seen one or two longfins that were atractive in thier own way.  But, they are not koi.  Koi do not have long fins.   *** If they’re not koi what are they?

They are longfinned carp with colored bodies.  They can’t be koi as they do not fit the requirements for the standards of the breed.  Saying a longfinned carp is a koi is like saying donkey is a horse.  They look like koi except for the fins.  Aren’t they a cross between the long finned carp and the koi?   Aren’t they fertile?

Yes to both counts.  Still doesn’t make them a koi.  You can say, “A koi is a carp, and a longfin is a carp, as far as it goes, so is a common carp.”  You can’t say a common carp or a longfin is a koi.  Longfins and koi are both common carps, or at least belong to the same genus and species as common carps (Cyprinus carpio). They have thier place in the ornamental fish world, and are even beginning to show up with thier own category in koi shows.  However, I’ve seen time and again, a longfin disqualified and not be judged as a koi, because it is not one. *** I see.  But to those of us not interested in shows or $5,000.00 koi for our ponds they are quite beautiful.  Speaking only for myself, I like to watch them swim around my ponds.

I got no problem with that at all.  I just say I wouldn’t like seeing them swimming around in my ponds. As to fish shows, I’ve many, many friends that show fish they bought from me and others, and win prizes, and payed as little as $30 for the fish.  A quick tale.  At one show a few years back I was asked, “what is the difference between the grand and reserve champions?”  Both were very good kohaku.  I knew the history behind both fish, one of them (the reserve champ, alas, was from my hatchery) the other from a famous Japanese hatchery.  I thought a moment and told the person, “The difference is about $49,925.”  The one fish had been purchased for $50K a few weeks before the show.  The other from me for $75 three years earlier.  I ask, “Who was the better fish keeper?” I’ve even had to be a longfin judge in the past at fish shows because most certified judges will not judge them.   *** Why?  Couldn’t be “snobbery” could it?   :O)

Well…actually, a judge has the authority to DQ any animal which does not fulfill the requirments of the breed.  You won’t find a dog judge judging a Heinz 57 as a poodle.  Same is true in koi.  The judge is only going to judge koi, he/she will not judge a striped bass or a longfin as a koi. I know they are popular in the US. *** They’re VERY popular here in TN. In Japan, even the breeder that did the most to develop the breed has given up and sold his breeding stock a few years back.  As far as I know, most longfins are now only bred in the US where there seems to be a strong market.   ***  Probably a market among the non show crowd such as myself, where health and beauty come before “what wins at the shows.”

That is indeed the market for almost all koi.  If I had to make my farm operate on the income from “show quality” fish it would have been out of business long ago.  My customers are interested in health and beauty, also. You won’t find any coming from my farm.   ***  You’re in business… us every day ponders are not.

I keep telling myself that.  My partner thinks we are BIG hobbiests. I must admit, though, I have been experimenting with “normal” koi out of longfin lineage as breeding stock for stronger koi. *** Sounds good… you’re adding new genes.

Always looking to breed a better, stronger animal.  Like you say, “Health and beauty”, in that order.  I see no point in trying to sell a fish so highly bred (and inbred) which looks remarkable, but anybody short of an expert can’t keep alive. I continue to try new things, some are my own ideas, some are those of my Japanese mentors.   Longfins are tough and grow fast and big, all good qualities which would be a benefit in koi.  I’ve not been doing it long enough to see if it might be working.   ***  I also like the BF’s slimmer build as it makes them appear even more graceful and elegant.  The quality I’ve seen this year far surpasses what was avalible even 2 years ago.

Folks are getting to where a dull brown fish with long fins isn’t enough anymore.  I’ve a friend in South Texas that breeds the most beautiful longfins I’ve seen.  The problem for his stunning specimens is finding a proper market that will bear the price he must get for such specimens.  If you think about it for a moment, longfins are primarily going into the “low end” market where fish must be priced inexpensively in order to sell.  There are not many “longfin collectors” looking to purchase very high quality stock costing $hundreds or even thousands as there are in koi.  He does like I do, enjoys his very best specimens himself as he has difficulty getting what they are worth (to him) from the market.  Even good longfin shouldn’t be sold cheap.   Brett – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text — Carol…   Brett

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Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

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Was it silver (gin) or platinum (white) Ogon (solid color) ? It really depends on where you are, here on Canada’s west coast you could expect to pay about $200 depending on quality, show koi going for thousands. If you really love it then pay what you think it’s worth to you. Dayleen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

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I was given one “similar” to this and the same size… they called it a ghost koi and the retail price was $125.00.  I bought a real small one later on for $10.00. —  Carol…   “It’s not hard to meet expenses; they’re everywhere.” Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp.

The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – would be a fair price on a Koi like this?

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In Missouri you can pay as much as $10.00 per inch.  Sometimes more depending on type of koi and you will be lucky to find butterfly koi this year here. VJ –

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

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The short answer seems, if the price is good for you then that’s all that matters.  Otherwise, could you tell us what they’re asking for the fish. That would give a better ballpark figure to know if you are being gouged or not.  I will agree that if the fish is as pretty as you say $100 is not outrageous. — Todo  —  North Florida Koi Club,

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

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Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

Bill:  It is just how much you want the fish.  I have to watch my pennies (old guy on a fixed income you know :-) ), so I figure I can earn $50 to $100 by buying a small quality fish and growing it to the size you mention in a year. vern — Visit my Ponds at:   HTTP://www.webpak.net/~vrolson

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Thanks, you all made me feel better of my purchase, I wasn’t sure if I did good or not!! I’m new at this, so I really appreciate the help. I guess you can tell I don’t know my “Koi Kolors”! As D/E van Ryswyk pointed out the color is a Platinum (Pure White), with very long flowing fins, all in  good shape. Now the weird part of the story starts! I had been to the nursery about a month ago, and first seen the this Koi. I had just left a fish store where they had 2 Koi just like this one for sale as a pair for $60.00, but they were about 2 1/2″ long. I asked the girl taking care of the fish, if that fish was for sale, and she said “No, because the fish in that pond are to hard to catch.” I left it at that, because the other store had the smaller ones, if I really wanted one that bad. Yesterday my cousin and I were driving around, and being that he also has a new pond, I wanted to show him the two Koi at the store, and I was thinking to myself that I might talk him into splitting the pair with me if he really liked them. Well of course the two were gone, so I took him over to the nursery to show him the big one. On the way I was thinking that being the end of the season, maybe they would make the effort to catch this fish, and sell it to me. When we got there, there was a different girl doing the pond stuff, so I asked her if the Koi in the front pond were for sale. The answer I got was,”Well I was told no by the other girl, but I think her opinion is biased, so I’ll go ask the owner.” She came back and said “yes, they are for sale, any fish in the pond for  $49.95″. Well after almost ripping the back pocket off my pants, trying to get to my wallet, (of course keeping my composure at all times!) I told her that the one I wanted was the White Butterfly Koi. she went and got two nets, and in about 10 min. it was in the bag (so to speak!) When we walked into the main store part of the nursery, you should have seen the heads turn! All the other sales girls were telling her that that Koi was not for sale! Then one of them said “none of the fish in that pond are for sale, ESPECIALLY THAT ONE !!” (well I thought the jig was up, and there was a large tear forming in me eye.) The sales girl replied that she had asked the owner, and even asked if he was sure, and he ok’ed the sale. Well we almost burned rubber leaving the place, and I’m hoping that other sales girl, that usually takes care of the fish at the nursery, is not lurking in my yard at night with a net, and a gun!! But I got the Koi for 49.99, and he seams very happy in my pond!!  Thanks again for the help. Bill Gunn      P.S. I wonder if she reads this news group!

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Thanks, you all made me feel better of my purchase, I wasn’t sure if I did good or not!!

<snip  But I got the Koi for 49.99, and he seams very happy in my pond!!  Thanks again for the help. Bill Gunn      P.S. I wonder if she reads this news group!

that was cheaper than wholesale cost on a fish/type that size :) —  Ken Arnold,  ICQ # 1028648  KenCo Fish & Supplies  Pond and Aquarium fish,  Shipping plants/fish etc. a specialty    Imported & domestic Koi,Goldfish,Orandas,  Tropicals,exotics, Piranhas etc.

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I recently bought a yellow butterfly with very little black shading -17 inches long for $200 at a retail store here in Santa Cruz, CA. Got tired of lurking! — Barry

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seen a Butterfly Koi today that really looked sharp. It was all silver (Actually shined from the sun at the bottom of a 5′ pond) with no other coloring, and the fins were really large and in perfect condition.(I’m using my own opinion on this) The Koi was 12 or 13″ long. What in your opinion would be a fair price on a Koi like this? TIA

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Barry, tired of lurking, wrote ~~I recently bought a yellow butterfly with very little black shading -17 inches long for $200 at a retail store here in Santa Cruz, CA. ~~ Hi Barry! Welcome to rec.ponds! Every once in a while I get an attack of koi envy and your new butterfly did it. Sounds like a loverly fish. k30 and the water gardening labradors REC.PONDS INFORMAL FAQ PAGE http://hometown.aol.com/k30a/myhomepage/writing.html

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Hi Barry, welcome to the group. Tell us about your pond and fish….   :o ) —  Carol…   “Jury: Twelve people who determine which client has the better attorney.” – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Got tired of lurking!

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Prices for Koi at Local Breeder, seems to charge the same for Butterfly Koi, these prices are approximate, but very close. Once they hit 12″ the price skyrockets! 10 to 24″……I don’t know, never seen one priced at this breeder of this size.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Prices for Koi at Local Breeder, seems to charge the same for Butterfly Koi, these prices are approximate, but very close. Once they hit 12″ the price skyrockets! 10 to 24″……I don’t know, never seen one priced at this breeder of this size.

If yall are buying “Butterfly Koi”, you’re getting ripped off even if you are getting $10 to take the fish away. Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph. Brett

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Last week I was at Petsmart and saw the a gorgeous butterfly koi–all shiny bright yellow with black trim, about 5 inches long for 3 bucks.

The Petsmart in my area also carries koi for $1.99 and up.  I bought 6 3″ koi last spring ($1.99 each) and they are now beautiful fish.  A few are metallic orange and some are yellow, one is bluish,… some have sparkle/diamond scales, one doesn’t… what beauties!   The 5″ koi they were selling were $9.99 and they had a few real nice one’s about 8″ that were $69.99.  There were not butterfly koi though. I found really choice butterfly koi at the Aquatic Critter in Nashville for $5.99 and up.  This is all colors too, and all sizes.  I bought a bunch of them.  :o) —  Carol…   “The only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth.” – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

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Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph.

WHAT?  Are ye daft?  They’re beautiful with those long flowing fins, they’re so graceful, so ethereal…. and they come in so many colors. —  Carol…  likes all koi…. and GF…. “The only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth.”

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Koi for money? I partake in the Jan Jordan Fish Adoption program. k30 and the water gardening labradors REC.PONDS INFORMAL FAQ PAGE http://hometown.aol.com/k30a/myhomepage/writing.html

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Prices for Koi at Local Breeder, seems to charge the same for Butterfly Koi, these prices are approximate, but very close. Once they hit 12″ the price skyrockets! 10 to 24″……I don’t know, never seen one priced at this breeder of this size.  If yall are buying “Butterfly Koi”, you’re getting ripped off even if you

are getting $10 to take the fish away. Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph. Brett

NO way…. I know what I like and I like butterfly koi….. they are prettier and showier.. vj

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Butterfly koi, not even koi, harrrumph. WHAT?  Are ye daft?  They’re beautiful with those long flowing fins, they’re so graceful, so ethereal…. and they come in so many colors. — Carol…  likes all koi…. and GF…. “The only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth.”

They are deformed and fly in the face of true animal breeding tenets.  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.  Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. The “breed anything for money” mentality doesn’t work well in horses, dogs, or fish.   OTOH, I have seen one or two longfins that were atractive in thier own way.  But, they are not koi.  Koi do not have long fins.  They have thier place in the ornamental fish world, and are even beginning to show up with thier own category in koi shows.  However, I’ve seen time and again, a longfin disqualified and not be judged as a koi, because it is not one. I’ve even had to be a longfin judge in the past at fish shows because most certified judges will not judge them.   I know they are popular in the US.  In Japan, even the breeder that did the most to develop the breed has given up and sold his breeding stock a few years back.  As far as I know, most longfins are now only bred in the US where there seems to be a strong market.   You won’t find any coming from my farm.  I must admit, though, I have been experimenting with “normal” koi out of longfin lineage as breeding stock for stronger koi.  Longfins are tough and grow fast and big, all good qualities which would be a benefit in koi.  I’ve not been doing it long enough to see if it might be working.   Brett

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Brett knows a lot about Koi breeding, as the folks in this group are well aware of . To ridicule someone about text wrapping is irrelevant , and tells everybody you just figured it out.            Vince GMT):  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.  Propogating

physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Obviously, you know little about breeding (or how to keep lines to < 79 chars, at most (heh-heh)  Corne1 Huth  -  http://40th.com/  Bullet database engines/servers 3.1  Win32-WinCE-OS2-Linux+

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By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.  Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition

(for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. Obviously, you know little about breeding (or how to keep lines to < 79 chars, at most).  Breeders only care about what sells, that’s the way it is, and in-breeding gets you what in-breeding gets you.  My butterfly koi are kool koi.  My BK are tough koi.  BK probably aren’t what you sell, so it’s easy (and in your best interest) to poo-poo BK. (heh-heh) Corne1 Huth  -  http://40th.com/ Bullet database engines/servers 3.1  Win32-WinCE-OS2-Linux+

I have only been a fish breeder.  During the last 20 or so years, I’ve bred about 60 species and hybrids of fishes and invertebrates commercially.  During that entire time, I’ve practiced sound breeding and worked to improve the breed as well as make it profitable.  This has been the case with channel catfish for the table, largemouth bass for the fishing lake, and koi for the back yard pool.   Each operation in which I was the person responsible for breeding fish for whatever purpose has a record of my attempts to improve the breed for its intended use. My outbred strain of channel catfish grew quickly, had an excellent dress out percentage, and was resistant to poor water quality and disease.  For five years, I bred and stocked over 35 million channel catfish each year.  I used selected stock from nine states, including strains from private, state and federal sources.  The problems associated with breeding such huge numbers of animals is staggering.  In the 40 or so years of the catfish business in the US, catfish producers (not breeders) have managed to breed strains that are susceptible to every known disease, have as many as 15 extra fins, have heads 40% bigger than normal, and even cannot be caught with a seine.  Fish breeding by default instead of by design.   For the last decade or so, I’ve been breeding a “more catchable” strain of largemouth bass.  Catchability is a trait in bass as well as in catfish.  The trait is catchability and does not require inbreeding to bring it about.  More catchable bass are better suited to the purpose. And a buncha other stuff, like blue catfish, and hybrid buffalo fish, and coppernose bluegills, and threadfin shad, and tilapia, and …. Anyhow, your point is well taken, I don’t breed longfins and don’t care for them.  I do breed and sell. I don’t only care about “what sells”.  I could make a great deal more money by converting about half of my facility into longfin production. A pond grade longfin sells for 300% more than a pond grade koi and is about the same cost to produce.  There is a much bigger market for longfins in the US.  If I were really only interested in breeding what sells, I’d be breeding only longfins.  I wouldn’t have to compete with highly bred animals from 100 year old breeding farms.  It would be ever so much less difficult for me with respect to finances.  A feller from Texas doesn’t have to be Japanese to sell his longfin fish. Anybody can get a couple of longfins and raise a batch that will sell without having to sort and throw away most of the offspring.  No judges out there setting standards, no large population of stunning individuals with which to compete, a much less difficult landscape than that for a Texas koi breeder.  If it were only for the money, I’d have a farm full of longfins. But of course, I don’t know much about breeding, though. Brett

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Dont dis my fish!!!  Ingrid List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List for care of goldfish go to http://puregold.aquaria.net/

I dont understand how someone can push Dandys fish and keep mutts ;P couldnt resist….. —  Ken Arnold,  ICQ # 1028648  KenCo Fish & Supplies  Pond and Aquarium fish,  Shipping plants/fish etc. a specialty    Imported & domestic Koi,Goldfish,Orandas,  Tropicals,exotics, Piranhas etc.

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But of course, I don’t know much about breeding, though. Meant breeders, but okay, if you say so. Corne1 Huth  -  http://40th.com/ Bullet database engines/servers 3.1  Win32-WinCE-OS2-Linux+

Makes more sense to me now.  In that context, you are sadly correct in (most) of your assumptions. Brett

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They are deformed and fly in the face of true animal breeding

tenets.  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.

*** What do you mean exactly by deformed as it’s only the fins that are elongated.   Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me).  I feel very much the same about goldfish. *** I agree.  Some GF are so deformed (body and fins) that they look like freaks and surely are a burden to themselves.   The “breed anything for money” mentality doesn’t work well in horses,

dogs, or fish.   *** It must work… look at all the dog breeds – talk about deformities!  And the breeders find buyers. OTOH, I have seen one or two longfins that were atractive in thier

own way.  But, they are not koi.  Koi do not have long fins.

*** If they’re not koi what are they?  They look like koi except for the fins.  Aren’t they a cross between the long finned carp and the koi?   Aren’t they fertile? They have thier place in the ornamental fish world, and are even beginning to show up with thier own category in koi shows.  However, I’ve seen time and again, a longfin disqualified and

not be judged as a koi, because it is not one. *** I see.  But to those of us not interested in shows or $5,000.00 koi for our ponds they are quite beautiful.  Speaking only for myself, I like to watch them swim around my ponds. I’ve even had to be a longfin judge in the past at fish shows because

most certified judges will not judge them.   *** Why?  Couldn’t be “snobbery” could it?   :O) I know they are popular in the US.

*** They’re VERY popular here in TN.  In Japan, even the breeder that did the most to develop the breed has given up and sold his breeding stock a few years back.  As far as I know, most longfins

are now only bred in the US where there seems to be a strong market.

***  Probably a market among the non show crowd such as myself, where health and beauty come before “what wins at the shows.” You won’t find any coming from my farm.

***  You’re in business… us every day ponders are not. I must admit, though, I have been experimenting with “normal” koi out of longfin lineage as breeding stock for stronger koi.

*** Sounds good… you’re adding new genes.  Longfins are tough and grow fast and big, all good qualities which would be a benefit in koi.  I’ve not been doing it long enough to see if it

might be working.   ***  I also like the BF’s slimmer build as it makes them appear even more graceful and elegant.  The quality I’ve seen this year far surpasses what was avalible even 2 years ago. —  Carol…   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Brett

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If you waited to adopt BF koi here you better plan to live a few hundred years. —  Carol…   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Koi for money? I partake in the Jan Jordan Fish Adoption program.

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They are deformed and fly in the face of true animal breeding tenets.  By definition, a breeder is working to improve the breed.   *** What do you mean exactly by deformed as it’s only the fins that are elongated.

That is a deformity.  You would not find such an animal surviving outside of captivity.   Propogating physical deformities does not fit that definition (for me). I feel very much the same about goldfish. *** I agree.  Some GF are so deformed (body and fins) that they look like freaks and surely are a burden to themselves.

They are. I like goldfish even less than longfins, with the exception of sarassa comets.  I find them very attractive. The “breed anything for money” mentality doesn’t work well in horses, dogs, or fish.   *** It must work… look at all the dog breeds – talk about deformities!  And the breeders find buyers.

You’re right, it works well with respect to finances, not with respect to biology.  How long is a “papillon” going to live outside of a climate controlled kennel (or home) without a highly regulated diet?  Same is true for those “bulbous eyed” goldfish.  The first osprey that comes along is going to have a hard choice between them.  Probly catch and eat both in the same day. OTOH, I have seen one or two longfins that were atractive in thier own way.  But, they are not koi.  Koi do not have long fins.   *** If they’re not koi what are they?

They are longfinned carp with colored bodies.  They can’t be koi as they do not fit the requirements for the standards of the breed.  Saying a longfinned carp is a koi is like saying donkey is a horse.  They look like koi except for the fins.  Aren’t they a cross between the long finned carp and the koi?   Aren’t they fertile?

Yes to both counts.  Still doesn’t make them a koi.  You can say, “A koi is a carp, and a longfin is a carp, as far as it goes, so is a common carp.”  You can’t say a common carp or a longfin is a koi.  Longfins and koi are both common carps, or at least belong to the same genus and species as common carps (Cyprinus carpio). They have thier place in the ornamental fish world, and are even beginning to show up with thier own category in koi shows.  However, I’ve seen time and again, a longfin disqualified and not be judged as a koi, because it is not one. *** I see.  But to those of us not interested in shows or $5,000.00 koi for our ponds they are quite beautiful.  Speaking only for myself, I like to watch them swim around my ponds.

I got no problem with that at all.  I just say I wouldn’t like seeing them swimming around in my ponds. As to fish shows, I’ve many, many friends that show fish they bought from me and others, and win prizes, and payed as little as $30 for the fish.  A quick tale.  At one show a few years back I was asked, “what is the difference between the grand and reserve champions?”  Both were very good kohaku.  I knew the history behind both fish, one of them (the reserve champ, alas, was from my hatchery) the other from a famous Japanese hatchery.  I thought a moment and told the person, “The difference is about $49,925.”  The one fish had been purchased for $50K a few weeks before the show.  The other from me for $75 three years earlier.  I ask, “Who was the better fish keeper?” I’ve even had to be a longfin judge in the past at fish shows because most certified judges will not judge them.   *** Why?  Couldn’t be “snobbery” could it?   :O)

Well…actually, a judge has the authority to DQ any animal which does not fulfill the requirments of the breed.  You won’t find a dog judge judging a Heinz 57 as a poodle.  Same is true in koi.  The judge is only going to judge koi, he/she will not judge a striped bass or a longfin as a koi. I know they are popular in the US. *** They’re VERY popular here in TN. In Japan, even the breeder that did the most to develop the breed has given up and sold his breeding stock a few years back.  As far as I know, most longfins are now only bred in the US where there seems to be a strong market.   ***  Probably a market among the non show crowd such as myself, where health and beauty come before “what wins at the shows.”

That is indeed the market for almost all koi.  If I had to make my farm operate on the income from “show quality” fish it would have been out of business long ago.  My customers are interested in health and beauty, also. You won’t find any coming from my farm.   ***  You’re in business… us every day ponders are not.

I keep telling myself that.  My partner thinks we are BIG hobbiests. I must admit, though, I have been experimenting with “normal” koi out of longfin lineage as breeding stock for stronger koi. *** Sounds good… you’re adding new genes.

Always looking to breed a better, stronger animal.  Like you say, “Health and beauty”, in that order.  I see no point in trying to sell a fish so highly bred (and inbred) which looks remarkable, but anybody short of an expert can’t keep alive. I continue to try new things, some are my own ideas, some are those of my Japanese mentors.   Longfins are tough and grow fast and big, all good qualities which would be a benefit in koi.  I’ve not been doing it long enough to see if it might be working.   ***  I also like the BF’s slimmer build as it makes them appear even more graceful and elegant.  The quality I’ve seen this year far surpasses what was avalible even 2 years ago.

Folks are getting to where a dull brown fish with long fins isn’t enough anymore.  I’ve a friend in South Texas that breeds the most beautiful longfins I’ve seen.  The problem for his stunning specimens is finding a proper market that will bear the price he must get for such specimens.  If you think about it for a moment, longfins are primarily going into the “low end” market where fish must be priced inexpensively in order to sell.  There are not many “longfin collectors” looking to purchase very high quality stock costing $hundreds or even thousands as there are in koi.  He does like I do, enjoys his very best specimens himself as he has difficulty getting what they are worth (to him) from the market.  Even good longfin shouldn’t be sold cheap.   Brett – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text — Carol…   Brett

Response:

record largemouth largemouth bass facts(truth?)

Question:

largemouth bass facts Sorry to interject fellas, but that was the most rediculous exchange of words I’ve seen on these boards for many moons

Warran I think what you are politely trying to say is that Steve is mooning the group with his verbal tenacity.largemouth bass facts The guy actually had a free-spool casting reel & nylon (?) line. Warren Actually, A free spool casting reel and nylon line in the 30’s was real high tech.  If ol’ George was around today, he’d probably have graphite rods, multi bearing reels and be using Kevlar line. But that’s just my take on things

That’s Steve & yourself Al.largemouth bass facts  Seriously, in pounds & ounces, what are the official Canadian bass records.  largemouth bass facts Warran writes: (snip) Sorry to interject fellas, but that was the most rediculous exchange of words I’ve seen on these boards for many moons Warran I think what you are politely trying to say is that Steve is mooning the group with his verbal tenacity. Al

Response:

Great stuff W2, and thanks for the invite.  I hope it’s a long-standing invite, cause  ya never know.  Bad on me for the 11-2 smallie.  Needless to say namesake, if you’re ever out on the right coast… W1 :-) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – W1, OK, but you’ll have to buy a special fishing license for this lake.  But if you came from PA to CA to catch a big’un, probably another $10 wouldn’t bother you.  This is a small lake, not open to the general public; probably about 2-3 acres or so.  I’m told the lake is about 15′ now, would be deeper after the winter rains and spring run off.  Another private lake about a mile from this supposedly has a lot of 15″-18″ bass (about every cast).  The individual who told me this runs a small sporting goods store with BPS equipment and he supposedly is the local expert on these lakes (there are four total, one is a catch and release only, all have a 15″ limit).  Tell you what:  you come out, I’ll put you up, pick you up at the Sacramento airport and take you back.  (No power boats allowed, canoes or small rowboats would be plenty big enough for these lakes.  The lunker lake has easy access and a dock.  Very large rocks (15′ diameter at the north end where the lake narrows into a “V”) probably make for some great ambush cover for the LMB. On the issue of smallies:  the February issue of Outdoor Life had a half page article on the smallmouth world record.  According to the article, “The all-time smallmouth bass record has been reinstated at the National Fresh Water Fishing Hall of Fame in Hayward, Wis.  The famous fish, caught by David Hayes in July 1955, was deposed in 1996 amid allegations that the fish was tampered with to increase its weight.” Allegations were that Hayes’ guide, who claimed to have inserted motor parts in the fish was not even at the Cedar Hill dock when Hayes was there, and the guide’s supposed statement was not notarized, nor even signed.  This lack of evidence convinced the NFWFHF to reinstate Hayes’ fish as the record.  However, the International Game Fish Association disagrees, and maintains the 10 lb – 14 oz. fish caught by John T. Gorman in 1969 is the true record. All this information is on page 16 of the February issue of Outdoor Life. Warren Funk I’ll be there in April W2!  Actually, I’m assuming Craig is jesting with Al, as the 11-15 smallmouth is actually the bass that was disqualified (decades after the catch, about 3 years ago) as the standing record.  I believe the smallmouth record is now 11-1 or 11-2, also from Dale Hollow (I could be wrong).  George Perry did indeed catch a 22-4 largemouth bass in 1932.  At the time, during the heart of the Great Depression, Perry had no reason to lie or cheat to get the record;  his entire financial gain was something like a $100 gift certificate from a Sports Afield contest.  Once again, I could be wrong on the specifics of the story… Warren Craig, according to my information, there are two other bass larger than Easley’s.  These come in ranked #2 and #3 in the top ten, allowing, of course, that Perry’s fish is still considered #1. 2. 22-01 BOB CRUPI         3-12-91     LAKE CASTAIC,CA. 3. 21-12 MIKE AURJO       3-5-91       LAKE CASTAIC,CA. I was just recently told of a small lake near me that has fish from 13 to 15 pounds in it.  It is unfishable until next spring, but I certainly plan on giving it a go then! Warren2 George Perry’s record of 22lbs 4 oz, of 1932 is a lie, and always has been. Perry’s best friend indicated that he and George stuffed the fish with at least three pounds of lead.  A Death Bed confession.  Making in my opinion Raymond Easley’s 21 lbs., 3-1/2 oz., in California’s Lake Casitas in 1980 the true World Record Largemouth Bass. Although David L. Hayes holds the smallmouth record with 11 lbs, 15 oz., in Dale Hollow (Kentucky/Tennessee). But the fact is the IGFA has much more stringent requirements today th an they did in the past.  Most of the old record fish would be eliminated if they had to meet today’s standards. — Craig Baugher

Response:

The guy actually had a free-spool casting reel & nylon (?) line. Warren

Actually, A free spool casting reel and nylon line in the 30’s was real high tech.  If ol’ George was around today, he’d probably have graphite rods, multi bearing reels and be using Kevlar line. But that’s just my take on things, –

Response:

The guy actually had a free-spool casting reel & nylon (?) line. Warren – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on. in 1932?? new fangled gear was anything other than a cane pole. Tyler Brinks Henderson, NV Lake Mead

Response:

W1, OK, but you’ll have to buy a special fishing license for this lake.  But if you came from PA to CA to catch a big’un, probably another $10 wouldn’t bother you.  This is a small lake, not open to the general public; probably about 2-3 acres or so.  I’m told the lake is about 15′ now, would be deeper after the winter rains and spring run off.  Another private lake about a mile from this supposedly has a lot of 15″-18″ bass (about every cast).  The individual who told me this runs a small sporting goods store with BPS equipment and he supposedly is the local expert on these lakes (there are four total, one is a catch and release only, all have a 15″ limit).  Tell you what:  you come out, I’ll put you up, pick you up at the Sacramento airport and take you back.  (No power boats allowed, canoes or small rowboats would be plenty big enough for these lakes.  The lunker lake has easy access and a dock.  Very large rocks (15′ diameter at the north end where the lake narrows into a “V”) probably make for some great ambush cover for the LMB. On the issue of smallies:  the February issue of Outdoor Life had a half page article on the smallmouth world record.  According to the article, “The all-time smallmouth bass record has been reinstated at the National Fresh Water Fishing Hall of Fame in Hayward, Wis.  The famous fish, caught by David Hayes in July 1955, was deposed in 1996 amid allegations that the fish was tampered with to increase its weight.” Allegations were that Hayes’ guide, who claimed to have inserted motor parts in the fish was not even at the Cedar Hill dock when Hayes was there, and the guide’s supposed statement was not notarized, nor even signed.  This lack of evidence convinced the NFWFHF to reinstate Hayes’ fish as the record.  However, the International Game Fish Association disagrees, and maintains the 10 lb – 14 oz. fish caught by John T. Gorman in 1969 is the true record. All this information is on page 16 of the February issue of Outdoor Life. Warren Funk

I’ll be there in April W2!  Actually, I’m assuming Craig is jesting with

Al, as the 11-15 smallmouth is actually the bass that was disqualified (decades after the catch, about 3 years ago) as the standing record.  I believe the smallmouth record is now 11-1 or 11-2, also from Dale Hollow (I could be wrong).  George Perry did indeed catch a 22-4 largemouth bass in 1932.  At the time, during the heart of the Great Depression, Perry had no reason to lie or cheat to get the record;  his entire financial gain was something like a $100 gift certificate from a Sports Afield contest.  Once again, I could be wrong on the specifics of the story… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Warren Craig, according to my information, there are two other bass larger than Easley’s.  These come in ranked #2 and #3 in the top ten, allowing, of course, that Perry’s fish is still considered #1. 2. 22-01 BOB CRUPI         3-12-91     LAKE CASTAIC,CA. 3. 21-12 MIKE AURJO       3-5-91       LAKE CASTAIC,CA. I was just recently told of a small lake near me that has fish from 13 to 15 pounds in it.  It is unfishable until next spring, but I certainly plan on giving it a go then! Warren2 George Perry’s record of 22lbs 4 oz, of 1932 is a lie, and always has been. Perry’s best friend indicated that he and George stuffed the fish with at least three pounds of lead.  A Death Bed confession.  Making in my opinion Raymond Easley’s 21 lbs., 3-1/2 oz., in California’s Lake Casitas in 1980 the true World Record Largemouth Bass. Although David L. Hayes holds the smallmouth record with 11 lbs, 15 oz., in Dale Hollow (Kentucky/Tennessee). But the fact is the IGFA has much more stringent requirements today th an they did in the past.  Most of the old record fish would be eliminated if they had to meet today’s standards. — Craig Baugher

Response:

Sorry to interject fellas, but that was the most rediculous exchange of words I’ve seen on these boards for many moons.  How much are the official Canadian records for bass you guys?  Details!  Not in metric, either ;-) Warren – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Al…..you cut me to the bone……implying that I am full of the most commonly used word in the bass fishers vocabulary :-) …..ME……?     I have forgotten more than you will probably ever know ;-)  The recognized LM record from Canada is held by Mario Crysanthou, caught in Preston lake in 1976. No length or girth was submitted and no picture…. so I am going to hold on to the local flavor of Stoner lake, thankyou very much, at least I waters????  I did a calculation from one hundred averaged smallmouth with a length of 28.75 inches and got a total of 9.9 LBS, finding that my dad has the record for smallmouth by one ounce!  I can hardly wait to tell him the news at Christmas this year!!  Here’s a couple of Canadian records that would be easy to break,  Grass Pickerel 0.5 LBS, Pumpkinseed 1.0 LBS, and this one just might be up your alley, the Sturgeon, 168.0 LBS caught  FROM SHORE! —                                    Steve from Stoner. I’m not saying your full of the most commonly used word in the universe. But I bet the guys & gals at the office where you work refer to you as the exagerator. You mean to say you have measured 100 near record smallies and i suppose you are saying that you caught them. One other thought you may work in the office at Natural Resources and the fisheries officer is supplying you with the data. Some of the things you say cast a bit of skeptism about this now missing skin mount. Do you blame me for saying what you are saying between the lines. Al

Response:

I’ll be there in April W2!  Actually, I’m assuming Craig is jesting with Al, as the 11-15 smallmouth is actually the bass that was disqualified (decades after the catch, about 3 years ago) as the standing record.  I believe the smallmouth record is now 11-1 or 11-2, also from Dale Hollow (I could be wrong).  George Perry did indeed catch a 22-4 largemouth bass in 1932.  At the time, during the heart of the Great Depression, Perry had no reason to lie or cheat to get the record;  his entire financial gain was something like a $100 gift certificate from a Sports Afield contest.  Once again, I could be wrong on the specifics of the story… Warren – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Craig, according to my information, there are two other bass larger than Easley’s.  These come in ranked #2 and #3 in the top ten, allowing, of course, that Perry’s fish is still considered #1. 2. 22-01 BOB CRUPI         3-12-91     LAKE CASTAIC,CA. 3. 21-12 MIKE AURJO       3-5-91       LAKE CASTAIC,CA. I was just recently told of a small lake near me that has fish from 13 to 15 pounds in it.  It is unfishable until next spring, but I certainly plan on giving it a go then! Warren2 George Perry’s record of 22lbs 4 oz, of 1932 is a lie, and always has been. Perry’s best friend indicated that he and George stuffed the fish with at least three pounds of lead.  A Death Bed confession.  Making in my opinion Raymond Easley’s 21 lbs., 3-1/2 oz., in California’s Lake Casitas in 1980 the true World Record Largemouth Bass. Although David L. Hayes holds the smallmouth record with 11 lbs, 15 oz., in Dale Hollow (Kentucky/Tennessee). But the fact is the IGFA has much more stringent requirements today than they did in the past.  Most of the old record fish would be eliminated if they had to meet today’s standards. — Craig Baugher

Response:

he Sturgeon, 168.0 LBS caught  FROM SHORE! –

that must have been really difficult since the one I caught dragged the boat 10 miles down shore. Tyler Brinks Henderson, NV Lake Mead

Response:

Al…..you cut me to the bone……implying that I am full of the most – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -commonly used word in the bass fishers vocabulary :-) …..ME……?     I have forgotten more than you will probably ever know ;-)  The recognized LM record from Canada is held by Mario Crysanthou, caught in Preston lake in 1976. No length or girth was submitted and no picture…. so I am going to hold on to the local flavor of Stoner lake, thankyou very much, at least I waters????  I did a calculation from one hundred averaged smallmouth with a length of 28.75 inches and got a total of 9.9 LBS, finding that my dad has the record for smallmouth by one ounce!  I can hardly wait to tell him the news at Christmas this year!!  Here’s a couple of Canadian records that would be easy to break,  Grass Pickerel 0.5 LBS, Pumpkinseed 1.0 LBS, and this one just might be up your alley, the Sturgeon, 168.0 LBS caught  FROM SHORE! —                                    Steve from Stoner.

I’m not saying your full of the most commonly used word in the universe. But I bet the guys & gals at the office where you work refer to you as the exagerator. You mean to say you have measured 100 near record smallies and i suppose you are saying that you caught them. One other thought you may work in the office at Natural Resources and the fisheries officer is supplying you with the data. Some of the things you say cast a bit of skeptism about this now missing skin mount. Do you blame me for saying what you are saying between the lines. Al

Response:

Al…..you cut me to the bone……implying that I am full of the most commonly used word in the bass fishers vocabulary :-) …..ME……?     I have forgotten more than you will probably ever know ;-)  The recognized LM record from Canada is held by Mario Crysanthou, caught in Preston lake in 1976. No length or girth was submitted and no picture…. so I am going to hold on to the local flavor of Stoner lake, thankyou very much, at least I waters????  I did a calculation from one hundred averaged smallmouth with a length of 28.75 inches and got a total of 9.9 LBS, finding that my dad has the record for smallmouth by one ounce!  I can hardly wait to tell him the news at Christmas this year!!  Here’s a couple of Canadian records that would be easy to break,  Grass Pickerel 0.5 LBS, Pumpkinseed 1.0 LBS, and this one just might be up your alley, the Sturgeon, 168.0 LBS caught  FROM SHORE! —                                     Steve from Stoner.

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Steve I seem to be getting the gist of what your saying. With this massive wave of commercialization of bass fishing there is zero tolerance any more for people who want  to use the cheapo equipment that you might find at an establishment like walmart. Sometimes if you even write about it your scared you could be shunted. I like your point in the early days many a large fish was caught on cheapo tackle and consumed. As far as the mounted record skin which has now dropped out of sight i can’t help feeling a little skeptical. In that hardware store your talking about did they also have a rare Canadian fur bearing trout eh. Now i hope your getting the gist of what i am saying. Al

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Who knows Al?  It was after all “the old days”  when it was probably caught on some basic cheapo rod line and sinker in some water somewhere in maybe Canada? Weighed on a cheapo set of scales. Local lore has it Stony was the water the trophy was taken from, could have been Clear lake.  The skin mount was in the old hardware store for years but has moved to another location in a tackle store but I am not sure of this. When I go back up to the lake in the spring I will find out what happened to it for you, maybe I will ask a friend who lives up there all year round if he knows where the mounted bass has gone to.  I will go as far to say that when I was a kid of twelveish my dad and I cleaned two smallmouths, one night,  that were over twenty-four inches, one of which was twenty eight and three quarters inches long, record? Maybe? I will guarantee that, those fish where caught on cheapo equipt. That was in a small lake in the Muskokas, about fifteen acres, just south of Port Carling, it still has some big bronzies in it today.  Stoner lake still has some nice smallies in too ;-) . —                                    Steve from Stony

Steve I seem to be getting the gist of what your saying. With this massive wave of commercialization of bass fishing there is zero tolerance any more for people who want  to use the cheapo equipment that you might find at an establishment like walmart. Sometimes if you even write about it your scared you could be shunted. I like your point in the early days many a large fish was caught on cheapo tackle and consumed. As far as the mounted record skin which has now dropped out of sight i can’t help feeling a little skeptical. In that hardware store your talking about did they also have a rare Canadian fur bearing trout eh. Now i hope your getting the gist of what i am saying. Al

Response:

Who knows Al?  It was after all “the old days”  when it was probably caught on some basic cheapo rod line and sinker in some water somewhere in maybe Canada? Weighed on a cheapo set of scales. Local lore has it Stony was the water the trophy was taken from, could have been Clear lake.  The skin mount was in the old hardware store for years but has moved to another location in a tackle store but I am not sure of this. When I go back up to the lake in the spring I will find out what happened to it for you, maybe I will ask a friend who lives up there all year round if he knows where the mounted bass has gone to.  I will go as far to say that when I was a kid of twelveish my dad and I cleaned two smallmouths, one night,  that were over twenty-four inches, one of which was twenty eight and three quarters inches long, record? Maybe? I will guarantee that, those fish where caught on cheapo equipt. That was in a small lake in the Muskokas, about fifteen acres, just south of Port Carling, it still has some big bronzies in it today.  Stoner lake still has some nice smallies in too ;-) . —                                     Steve from Stony

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Steve writes LOL! AL you break me down! I don’t think you would want to know what I think ;-)  The old skin mount is still in Lakefield. Steve Is what you are saying that there is a mounted largemouth bass that is the Ontario/Canada record. Lakefield is where i believe wood canoes were made, possibly even cedar canvas canoes. Now if the mounted fish is there our next question would be where was it caught. Was it in fact caught in you very own Stoner Lake. I believe that your are trying to indirectly tell the newsgroup that this is the case. My own belief is that in the early days it would not be uncommon to see 6lb (smallmouth) bass in pairs combing the shorelines for minnows, frogs,crayfish. Like south of the border a record could have easily been taken and consumed at the dinner table. To summarize where? when? by whom? Canadian/Ontario record? and can we come see it? Al

Response:

Craig, according to my information, there are two other bass larger than Easley’s.  These come in ranked #2 and #3 in the top ten, allowing, of course, that Perry’s fish is still considered #1. 2. 22-01 BOB CRUPI         3-12-91     LAKE CASTAIC,CA. 3. 21-12 MIKE AURJO       3-5-91       LAKE CASTAIC,CA. I was just recently told of a small lake near me that has fish from 13 to 15 pounds in it.  It is unfishable until next spring, but I certainly plan on giving it a go then! Warren2

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – George Perry’s record of 22lbs 4 oz, of 1932 is a lie, and always has been. Perry’s best friend indicated that he and George stuffed the fish with at least three pounds of lead.  A Death Bed confession.  Making in my opinion Raymond Easley’s 21 lbs., 3-1/2 oz., in California’s Lake Casitas in 1980 the true World Record Largemouth Bass. Although David L. Hayes holds the smallmouth record with 11 lbs, 15 oz., in Dale Hollow (Kentucky/Tennessee). But the fact is the IGFA has much more stringent requirements today than they did in the past.  Most of the old record fish would be eliminated if they had to meet today’s standards. — Craig Baugher

Response:

George Perry’s record of 22lbs 4 oz, of 1932 is a lie, and always has been. Perry’s best friend indicated that he and George stuffed the fish with at least three pounds of lead.  A Death Bed confession.  Making in my opinion Raymond Easley’s 21 lbs., 3-1/2 oz., in California’s Lake Casitas in 1980 the true World Record Largemouth Bass. Although David L. Hayes holds the smallmouth record with 11 lbs, 15 oz., in Dale Hollow (Kentucky/Tennessee). But the fact is the IGFA has much more stringent requirements today than they did in the past.  Most of the old record fish would be eliminated if they had to meet today’s standards. — Craig Baugher

Response:

Steve writes: Hey Al…..do you have any idea where the Canadian largemouth record was caught? —                                    Steve from Stoner

I dunno let me hazzard a guess where record breaking largemouth could be caught. Since you are posing the question and as odd as it is it just might be at your very own Stoner Lake. I here that the fisherman at your Stoner lake tend to exagerate a liitle, meaning a lot. One other place  where there is some rather sizeable largemouth bass is the area along the eastern shores of Lake Ontario. Probably the record bass was caught on the most basic equipment that you could not even phathom what it would be like I am talking about a cheapo rod and a line a sinker a live bait harness and of course the livebait itself. And again when it was caught the person probably saw the food value in it and ate it. Whadya think Al

Response:

Steve writes LOL! AL you break me down! I don’t think you would want to know what I think ;-)  The old skin mount is still in Lakefield.

Steve Is what you are saying that there is a mounted largemouth bass that is the Ontario/Canada record. Lakefield is where i believe wood canoes were made, possibly even cedar canvas canoes. Now if the mounted fish is there our next question would be where was it caught. Was it in fact caught in you very own Stoner Lake. I believe that your are trying to indirectly tell the newsgroup that this is the case. My own belief is that in the early days it would not be uncommon to see 6lb (smallmouth) bass in pairs combing the shorelines for minnows, frogs,crayfish. Like south of the border a record could have easily been taken and consumed at the dinner table. To summarize where? when? by whom? Canadian/Ontario record? and can we come see it? Al

Response:

Is it true the lad that caught the biggest bass (largemouth) did so on a old beatup wooden chub lure. He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on.

I suspect your informant/information is wrong. George Perry did indeed have a 22′/300 HP fibreglass rocket, was using IM9 graphite, superfluourocarbon, Terminator titanium gyro-worms and I understand he also lived in a single wide with not one, but 2 rusted out trucks on blocks like everyone else in Georgia… You’re welcome, Charles

Response:

Hey Al…..do you have any idea where the Canadian largemouth record was caught? —                                     Steve from Stoner

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it true the lad that caught the biggest bass (largemouth) did so on a old beatup wooden chub lure. He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on. And is it further true that having caught it he promply took it home and ate it.If the preceding is true then it would also likely true that the bass’s size was somewhat of a freak mutant so the record could very well might stand for a long time. I read it in a novel that I am now reading about a bass tourney (Double Whammy). There happens to be some neat and what i suspect are fictionalized characters so i was wondering if there was any truth to the record largemouth bass. Al

Response:

He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on.

in 1932?? new fangled gear was anything other than a cane pole. Tyler Brinks Henderson, NV Lake Mead

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LOL! AL you break me down! I don’t think you would want to know what I think ;-)  The old skin mount is still in Lakefield.  –                             Steve from Stony

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Steve writes: Hey Al…..do you have any idea where the Canadian largemouth record was caught? —                                    Steve from Stoner I dunno let me hazzard a guess where record breaking largemouth could be caught. Since you are posing the question and as odd as it is it just might be at your very own Stoner Lake. I here that the fisherman at your Stoner lake tend to exagerate a liitle, meaning a lot. One other place  where there is some rather sizeable largemouth bass is the area along the eastern shores of Lake Ontario. Probably the record bass was caught on the most basic equipment that you could not even phathom what it would be like I am talking about a cheapo rod and a line a sinker a live bait harness and of course the livebait itself. And again when it was caught the person probably saw the food value in it and ate it. Whadya think Al

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I don’t know about the world record, but just this year a guy could have broke the Oregon state record largemouth. I guess he wasn’t even a bass fisherman and he cleaned the fish!! When he showed it to some fellow anglers they were amazed at it’s size and had it weighed anyway! I guess the gutted fish weighed very close to the state record here (which is only around 11 or 12 pounds). Had it been weighed alive before it was cleaned…. it would have broke the record for sure!!!! Bobby Brown http://members.home.net/brown283/index

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it true the lad that caught the biggest bass (largemouth) did so on a old beatup wooden chub lure. He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on. And is it further true that having caught it he promply took it home and ate it.If the preceding is true then it would also likely true that the bass’s size was somewhat of a freak mutant so the record could very well might stand for a long time. I read it in a novel that I am now reading about a bass tourney (Double Whammy). There happens to be some neat and what i suspect are fictionalized characters so i was wondering if there was any truth to the record largemouth bass. Al

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Don’t hold me to this (at 60 (thank God) the mind was the first thing to go) but if I recall correctly, the record Largemouth was caught in a South or Middle Georgia pond and weighed in excess of 22 lbs. Don’t have a clue as to who caught it or what was used for bait. I would think for this size it would have been a 9 lb Bream :’) Ken Williams – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it true the lad that caught the biggest bass (largemouth) did so on a old beatup wooden chub lure. He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on. And is it further true that having caught it he promply took it home and ate it.If the preceding is true then it would also likely true that the bass’s size was somewhat of a freak mutant so the record could very well might stand for a long time. I read it in a novel that I am now reading about a bass tourney (Double Whammy). There happens to be some neat and what i suspect are fictionalized characters so i was wondering if there was any truth to the record largemouth bass. Al

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Is it true the lad that caught the biggest bass (largemouth) did so on a old beatup wooden chub lure. He did so in the absence of the new fangled bass gear including bass boat, wee well, depth finder etc. and the list goes on. And is it further true that having caught it he promply took it home and ate it.If the preceding is true then it would also likely true that the bass’s size was somewhat of a freak mutant so the record could very well might stand for a long time. I read it in a novel that I am now reading about a bass tourney (Double Whammy). There happens to be some neat and what i suspect are fictionalized characters so i was wondering if there was any truth to the record largemouth bass. Al

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Looking For Australian Bass Info largemouth bass recepies

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It might be one that is picked largemouth bass recepies up by a tornado and dropped off down under! — Go fishing. And may your fish be as big as your tales!

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Oz Bass??largemouth bass recepies? Is that another name for Great White Shark mate? Warren Anybody out there with some info on Oz Bass?  I would appreciate a hand.  I live in Brisbane Qld Cheers

Australian bass…..largemouth bass recepies..shaped a little like largemouth bass, larger scales similar to a carp lives in fresh/brackish water and spawns in saltwater! I found the following site that might be of some interest : http://www.fishnet.com.au

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Anybody out there with some info on Oz Bass?largemouth bass recepies  I would appreciate a hand.  I live in Brisbane Qld Cheers, Michael

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Oz Bass??? Is that another name for Great White Shark mate?largemouth bass recepies Anybody out there with some info on Oz Bass?  I would appreciate a hand.  I live in Brisbane Qld Cheers, Michael

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Phone Fishing? world largemouth bass record

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Bassbug I do not agree with your statement.world largemouth bass record  Studies have shown that stress levels due to fighting fish and improper handling of fish after they are caught are the major causes of delayed mortality in bass. I don’t know anyone who has ever “torn the mouth out of the fish” because a hook is barbed. world largemouth bass record  Maybe a young kid who doesn’t really know what he/she is doing. Also, fish in a controlled environment (aquarium) would be more likely to die from wounds because fish in a natural environment are genetically more hardy. I’m all for barbless bassin, but I’m sure many will agree that it is not the barb that causes death in fish. It is anglers who don’t know the proper way to fish a fish, anglers who don’t know the proper way to handle fish, and anglers (you see them on TV every weekend) who don’t know how long to keep a fish out of water. Try to hold your breath underwater for more than a minute and a half and you’ll see what I mean.world largemouth bass record  I don’t agree, If the hook is barbed, You are more likely to tare the mouth of the fish. If you ever had an aquarium, you would agree that wounds take some time to heal and are often fatal even in a controlled environment with proper medication. Barbed hooks only help add to the demise of the fish and should only be left to bait fishermen who generally fish for the table. A responsible “sportsman” bends down the barbs.

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another method of devious practise years ago was to use carbide, small stones and a glass jar. 1/3 carbide,world largemouth bass record enough stones to sink it and fill the jar with 1/2 water, slap the lid on tight and get rid of it into the deeper holding areas of the creeks (usually). When the carbide disolved, the gases built up and blew the jar into many small pieces. Sort of like a depth charge. Had to be fast though, several hands were injured in this practise. This was the poor mans dynamite. Carbide was readily available and cheap. Sort of reminds me of the joke,” you gonna talk, or fish?” Tight lines everyone! world largemouth bass record fishing was something that was done years ago.  You take an old crank phone with a length of wire attached to the generator (that’s what the crank does, it’s a hand cranked generator).  Drop the wire in the water and crank away, it will only stun a fish thats very close to the wire and if you leave them in the water, they will swim off.  I know all of this to be true as I watched my great granddad use one many times when I was very young.  He would “crank” up some fish and only get the good eating size.  The others would float for a few seconds and swim off.  It was illegal then and is now.  Another type of “fishing” that was popular during that time was using M-80’s (I’ve been told they are 1/4 stick of dynamite).  Light the fuse, toss in the water.  This would kill the fish outright and in a much larger area than the phone method. Keep in mind that fishing at that time, in that part of the country, was to feed your family.  It made a nice addition to the daily beans and blackstrap. I’m sure there will be some out there that will comment about how “barbaric” or “backward” this sounds, and by today’s standards, it is.  Keep in mind that the first grocery store in the area that I’m referring to was a Piggy Wiggly, opened in 1951.  Before that, the general store was where you got your staples, all fresh veggies were grown and all meat was either raised, hunted, or fished. Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic. Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

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I don’t think there’s a bassfisher alive who hasn’t been repelled at the sight of a little fighter with one eye gouged out, or a gill missing, or even a torn lip.  It just doesn’t seem right to wound and release.  So I use barbless hooks to make the wound as minimal as possible, and if one of the other trebles gets embedded in his body flesh I rub my finger in a circle around the wound then across the wound…whether this helps the mucus heal the wound I don’t know, but it makes me feel better when I release it.

Jim, Nice touch. :) As a matter of fact, I kiss every Bass I catch prior to releasing. However, there is a product called “Stress coat” sold at pet shops for wounded fish for a couple of bucks that can put on the wound to act as sort of a Band-Aid while the body flesh heals. A little drop will do ya. BassBug: Is it a sport or a religion?

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Keith Phone fishing was something that was done years ago.  You take an old crank phone with a length of wire attached to the generator (that’s what the crank does, it’s a hand cranked generator).  Drop the wire in the water and crank away, it will only stun a fish thats very close to the wire and if you leave them in the water, they will swim off.  I know all of this to be true as I watched my great granddad use one many times when I was very young.  He would “crank” up some fish and only get the good eating size.  The others would float for a few seconds and swim off.  It was illegal then and is now.  Another type of “fishing” that was popular during that time was using M-80’s (I’ve been told they are 1/4 stick of dynamite).  Light the fuse, toss in the water.  This would kill the fish outright and in a much larger area than the phone method. Keep in mind that fishing at that time, in that part of the country, was to feed your family.  It made a nice addition to the daily beans and blackstrap.  I’m sure there will be some out there that will comment about how “barbaric” or “backward” this sounds, and by today’s standards, it is.  Keep in mind that the first grocery store in the area that I’m referring to was a Piggy Wiggly, opened in 1951.  Before that, the general store was where you got your staples, all fresh veggies were grown and all meat was either raised, hunted, or fished. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic.  Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

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Bassbug, Wouldn’t it be nice if we could catch bass without injury from hooks?  I wonder if we will ever see such a lure.  I don’t think there’s a bassfisher alive who hasn’t been repelled at the sight of a little fighter with one eye gouged out, or a gill missing, or even a torn lip.  It just doesn’t seem right to wound and release.  So I use barbless hooks to make the wound as minimal as possible, and if one of the other trebles gets embedded in his body flesh I rub my finger in a circle around the wound then across the wound…whether this helps the mucus heal the wound I don’t know, but it makes me feel better when I release it. Jim Pankey USN (Ret.) “Barbless Bassin’” Bassbug wrote …<snip… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Barbed hooks only help add to the demise of the fish and should only be left to bait fishermen who generally fish for the table. A responsible “sportsman” bends down the barbs. BassBug: Is it a sport or a religion?

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Jim to be honest, I don’t believe barbless hooks reduces much mortality. The only thing it might accomplish is allow you to unhook a bass more quickly, thus reducing the time it is out of water.

I don’t agree, If the hook is barbed, You are more likely to tare the mouth of the fish. If you ever had an aquarium, you would agree that wounds take some time to heal and are often fatal even in a controlled environment with proper medication. Barbed hooks only help add to the demise of the fish and should only be left to bait fishermen who generally fish for the table. A responsible “sportsman” bends down the barbs. BassBug: Is it a sport or a religion?

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Jet skier always!!!!! — The RodMaker http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/2865

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This also electrocutes the jet skiiers to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead.  What do you catch first; a 220 LB jet skiier or a 12 lb Largemouth? Jim Hohmann May The Fish Be With You. Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic. Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

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Today I attended two club weigh-ins on a very popular, heavily fished local lake.  I noted a lot of damaged bass that had previously been caught…some had torn mouthparts, contusions, and some you could see were bloodied and torn from either natural causes (i.e., making or defending a bed–tailfins were ragged) or beating against the live well confinement (the snouts were bloodied and raw).  There were just three dead that I noted (at least one had been hooked deeply), but I think weigh-ins should be closely monitored for damaged fish and the results given to the appropriate State department for further study.  I was shocked to see the condition of the fish weighed in!  To me, it sounds an alarm…that the population of the species in that lake may be in trouble.  Of course I’m not an expert, but I’ve witnessed a lot of weigh-ins and never saw so many previously damaged fish. Jim Pankey USN (Ret.) “Barbless Bassin’”

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t think there’s a bassfisher alive who hasn’t been repelled at the sight of a little fighter with one eye gouged out, or a gill missing, or even a torn lip.  It just doesn’t seem right to wound and release.  So I use barbless hooks to make the wound as minimal as possible, and if one of the other trebles gets embedded in his body flesh I rub my finger in a circle around the wound then across the wound…whether this helps the mucus heal the wound I don’t know, but it makes me feel better when I release it. Jim, Nice touch. :) As a matter of fact, I kiss every Bass I catch prior to releasing. However, there is a product called “Stress coat” sold at pet shops for wounded fish for a couple of bucks that can put on the wound to act as sort of a Band-Aid while the body flesh heals. A little drop will do ya. BassBug: Is it a sport or a religion?

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John, that might explain something I saw at a local club tournament. Another John, who was my sponsor when I first met the club, hooked a 5+ pound beauty.  It was dead, he said, within an hour.  His live well was working, and he caught the beauty in relatively shallow water.  The toxic effects, which you mentioned, may have been the culprit.  I loved the disapointment in his eyes when he had to admit the fish was dead.  Told me he was my kind of fishermen, catch and release. — Go fishing. And may your fish be as big as your tales!

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jim to be honest, I don’t believe barbless hooks reduces much mortality. The only thing it might accomplish is allow you to unhook a bass more quickly, thus reducing the time it is out of water. I would think the area of hook penetration, longevity of the fight, handling of the fish, and the time before release would be the most important factors in determining the bass’ mortality rates. Most fish would encounter delayed mortality due to the stress of being caught and fought for long periods of time. Also the lactic acid build up in fish when they are fighting sometimes reaches toxic levels, which can cause death in extreme cases. Also anyone who keeps a bass outside of water for more than a minute or two is a fool if they think the bass is going to be ok. Even if it does not die from being out of water, it can suffer permanent brain damage from lack of oxygen or it can be very succeptible to viral infections if its slime coat is rubbed away too much. Catch ‘em, take a quick photo if you have to, admire ‘em, and quickly put her back. That’s my motto. And if you can hook ‘em and keep ‘em without barbs, then more power to ya :) Good fishing JohnM/MA If you want to flame, do it elsewhere.  Keith asked a question that I am familiar with since I have been with a person who used that method (one time) at night to illegally take game fish.  If Keith wants more information (it’s not specifically bass-fishing related) he can contact me at Meantime, good bass fishing. As an aside, I practice bassing with barbless hooks and read an older article in Field and Stream (I think) that stated literally no survival rate difference of largemouth bass hooked and released immediately with barbed or barbless hooks.  I’d like to find out more about any studies that may have been done, if you know of any.  Also, I am still going to fish barbless because I know for a fact they’re easier to get out of human skin than the barbed kind!  Ever been hooked in the back by a Big O? Jim Pankey USN (Ret.) “Barbless Bassin’” Hey, dipshit, it’s not art, it’s a crime. If you want dead fish, go to a fish market. Oh, and stay the hell out of this newsgroup, loser.

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That sounds like a good way to rid my lake of jet skiers too…lol! Warren – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – One time I farted in the water after eating one of my wife’s homemade barritos and had the same effect. BassBug: Is it a sport or a religion?

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One time I farted in the water after eating one of my wife’s homemade barritos and had the same effect. BassBug: Is it a sport or a religion?

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Sorta related, but have you all seen the commercial with the guy and his female companion at a tropical resort where they are skipping rocks over the water? Then his pager goes off and he picks it up and skips it across the water. Great commercial….

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I always carry a cell phone in the boat.  Never thought of it as a lure! Would a hand held GPS, on a very stout line, work as well?  And how would you present it! — Go fishing. And may your fish be as big as your tales! Yep!  Sure have…. ya betcha.     Just signed on with Radio Shack and one of the features of their cellular service, “Cell Phones N’West”  is “Phone Fishing”.. (Costs a little extra but…)   To make a long story short, when the system is used for Phone Fishing you MUST be sure that the fish are close by…. like in local, close proximity (to avoid the roaming charge). Then, just toss the cell phone into the cover (stump, brushpile, dock, etc.) and dial the number… and WHAMO! Fish everywhere.   (Gotta have an extra phone to do the calling and also, the phone you toss in should be attached to a retrieval system of some sort to make it repeatable.. Also the ones powered with the sealed lead-acid battery will get you through most of a day!)   Nothin’ like it! Just kidding.   Lenny Taylor’s post has the straight skinney on the topic. Regards, Bill Linn PS: Remember, the worst day of fishing is much better than the best day of work!    http://www.newsfeeds.com       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! ==—–

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Actually, there is still one place in the US where it was legal long after all other areas had been shut down to this method of “fishing”  I don’t know if it is still legal.  (A Southern Congressman who enjoyed the practice was able to push through an exemption for his favorite stretch of river by his vacation home some years ago) Anyway, the fine art of phone fishing involved using the generator from one of the old-style crank telephones.  The wires were draped into the water and the generator was hand-cranked to shock the fish. (This is essentially what the Fish & Game Department does when they do a “shock survey”).  The fish are stunned and float to the top.  The interesting thing is that any contact with anything metal, like a fishing net frame, or aluminum boat will cause them to lose the electrical charge, and they quickly recover.  Otherwise the charge dissipates over a minute or so and they return to their normal activity. As far as doing it yourself, I wouldn’t.  Most sportsmen would gleefully turn in someone who was doing a “wholesale harvest” of the fish in a local area. A completely legal version of this can be done with earthworms and a metal probe inserted into slightly moist soil.  Household current is connected to the probe and the worms will RAPIDLY come to the surface.  My elderly uncle gets his nightcrawlers this way in his yard. Take care. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic.  Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

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Yep!  Sure have…. ya betcha.     Just signed on with Radio Shack and one of the features of their cellular service, “Cell Phones N’West”  is “Phone Fishing”.. (Costs a little extra but…)   To make a long story short, when the system is used for Phone Fishing you MUST be sure that the fish are close by…. like in local, close proximity (to avoid the roaming charge). Then, just toss the cell phone into the cover (stump, brushpile, dock, etc.) and dial the number… and WHAMO! Fish everywhere.   (Gotta have an extra phone to do the calling and also, the phone you toss in should be attached to a retrieval system of some sort to make it repeatable.. Also the ones powered with the sealed lead-acid battery will get you through most of a day!)   Nothin’ like it! Just kidding.   Lenny Taylor’s post has the straight skinney on the topic. Regards, Bill Linn PS: Remember, the worst day of fishing is much better than the best day of work!    http://www.newsfeeds.com       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

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Lenny Not a very safe practice to be suggesting. Household current has killed many a fisherman. There was a commercial variant of this idea on the market at one time… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip A completely legal version of this can be done with earthworms and a metal probe inserted into slightly moist soil.  Household current is connected to the probe and the worms will RAPIDLY come to the surface.  My elderly uncle gets his nightcrawlers this way in his yard.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lenny Not a very safe practice to be suggesting. Household current has killed many a fisherman. There was a commercial variant of this idea on the market at one time… <snip A completely legal version of this can be done with earthworms and a metal probe inserted into slightly moist soil.  Household current is connected to the probe and the worms will RAPIDLY come to the surface.  My elderly uncle gets his nightcrawlers this way in his yard.

You only run one wire,,from the wide side of a plug..the ground takes care of the ground!!!

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I always carry a cell phone in the boat.  Never thought of it as a lure! Would a hand held GPS, on a very stout line, work as well?  And how would you present it! — Go fishing. And may your fish be as big as your tales!

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yep!  Sure have…. ya betcha.     Just signed on with Radio Shack and one of the features of their cellular service, “Cell Phones N’West”  is “Phone Fishing”.. (Costs a little extra but…)   To make a long story short, when the system is used for Phone Fishing you MUST be sure that the fish are close by…. like in local, close proximity (to avoid the roaming charge). Then, just toss the cell phone into the cover (stump, brushpile, dock, etc.) and dial the number… and WHAMO! Fish everywhere.   (Gotta have an extra phone to do the calling and also, the phone you toss in should be attached to a retrieval system of some sort to make it repeatable.. Also the ones powered with the sealed lead-acid battery will get you through most of a day!)   Nothin’ like it! Just kidding.   Lenny Taylor’s post has the straight skinney on the topic. Regards, Bill Linn PS: Remember, the worst day of fishing is much better than the best day of work!    http://www.newsfeeds.com       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

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This also electrocutes the jet skiiers to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead.  What do you catch first; a 220 LB jet skiier or a 12 lb Largemouth? Jim Hohmann May The Fish Be With You. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic.  Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

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Great response Jim,,,, — John “Mini” Maniaci Nitro State Team, Mercury Fresh Water Fishing Team, Bass Pro Shops Outdoor World Pro Staff Auburn Hills, MI US Code Title 47, Section 27(a)(2)(b), a computer/modem/printer meets the definition of a telephone fax machine. By Sec. 227(b)(1)(C), it is unlawful to send any unsolicited advertisement to such equipment, punishable by action to recover actual monetary loss, or $500.00, whichever is greater, for EACH violation. Emailing and/or responding to the above address constitutes acceptance of these terms. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -If you want to flame, do it elsewhere.  Keith asked a question that I am familiar with since I have been with a person who used that method (one time) at night to illegally take game fish.  If Keith wants more information (it’s not specifically bass-fishing related) he can contact me at Meantime, good bass fishing. As an aside, I practice bassing with barbless hooks and read an older article in Field and Stream (I think) that stated literally no survival rate difference of largemouth bass hooked and released immediately with barbed or barbless hooks.  I’d like to find out more about any studies that may have been done, if you know of any.  Also, I am still going to fish barbless because I know for a fact they’re easier to get out of human skin than the barbed kind!  Ever been hooked in the back by a Big O? Jim Pankey USN (Ret.) “Barbless Bassin’” Hey, dipshit, it’s not art, it’s a crime. If you want dead fish, go to a fish market. Oh, and stay the hell out of this newsgroup, loser.

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ROTFLMAO , Very good! Haven’t tried this presentation, must say I keep it as a last resort; Along with the stick of dynoomite I carry in the tackle box. Say anyone have a match? — The RodMaker http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/2865

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yep!  Sure have…. ya betcha.     Just signed on with Radio Shack and one of the features of their cellular service, “Cell Phones N’West”  is “Phone Fishing”.. (Costs a little extra but…)   To make a long story short, when the system is used for Phone Fishing you MUST be sure that the fish are close by…. like in local, close proximity (to avoid the roaming charge). Then, just toss the cell phone into the cover (stump, brushpile, dock, etc.) and dial the number… and WHAMO! Fish everywhere.   (Gotta have an extra phone to do the calling and also, the phone you toss in should be attached to a retrieval system of some sort to make it repeatable.. Also the ones powered with the sealed lead-acid battery will get you through most of a day!)   Nothin’ like it! Just kidding.   Lenny Taylor’s post has the straight skinney on the topic. Regards, Bill Linn PS: Remember, the worst day of fishing is much better than the best day of work!    http://www.newsfeeds.com       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

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I want the jet skier. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This also electrocutes the jet skiiers to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead.  What do you catch first; a 220 LB jet skiier or a 12 lb Largemouth? Jim Hohmann May The Fish Be With You. Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic.  Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

Response:

Jim to be honest, I don’t believe barbless hooks reduces much mortality. The only thing it might accomplish is allow you to unhook a bass more quickly, thus reducing the time it is out of water. I would think the area of hook penetration, longevity of the fight, handling of the fish, and the time before release would be the most important factors in determining the bass’ mortality rates. Most fish would encounter delayed mortality due to the stress of being caught and fought for long periods of time. Also the lactic acid build up in fish when they are fighting sometimes reaches toxic levels, which can cause death in extreme cases. Also anyone who keeps a bass outside of water for more than a minute or two is a fool if they think the bass is going to be ok. Even if it does not die from being out of water, it can suffer permanent brain damage from lack of oxygen or it can be very succeptible to viral infections if its slime coat is rubbed away too much. Catch ‘em, take a quick photo if you have to, admire ‘em, and quickly put her back. That’s my motto. And if you can hook ‘em and keep ‘em without barbs, then more power to ya :) Good fishing JohnM/MA – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -If you want to flame, do it elsewhere.  Keith asked a question that I am familiar with since I have been with a person who used that method (one time) at night to illegally take game fish.  If Keith wants more information (it’s not specifically bass-fishing related) he can contact me at Meantime, good bass fishing. As an aside, I practice bassing with barbless hooks and read an older article in Field and Stream (I think) that stated literally no survival rate difference of largemouth bass hooked and released immediately with barbed or barbless hooks.  I’d like to find out more about any studies that may have been done, if you know of any.  Also, I am still going to fish barbless because I know for a fact they’re easier to get out of human skin than the barbed kind!  Ever been hooked in the back by a Big O? Jim Pankey USN (Ret.) “Barbless Bassin’” Hey, dipshit, it’s not art, it’s a crime. If you want dead fish, go to a fish market. Oh, and stay the hell out of this newsgroup, loser.

Response:

Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic.  Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

Response:

Hey, dipshit, it’s not art, it’s a crime. If you want dead fish, go to a fish market. Oh, and stay the hell out of this newsgroup, loser. XLK9

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone heard of the ‘art’ of phone fishing?  I have been told tales by a few people of:  throwing an old phone in a pond and electrocuting the fish to the point where they rise to the top and are easily caught or dead. Any comments are appreciated as I am doing some research on the topic. Any URL’s would also be appreciated… Thanks, Keith (not the best fisherman)

Response:

If you want to flame, do it elsewhere.  Keith asked a question that I am familiar with since I have been with a person who used that method (one time) at night to illegally take game fish.  If Keith wants more information (it’s not specifically bass-fishing related) he can contact me at Meantime, good bass fishing. As an aside, I practice bassing with barbless hooks and read an older article in Field and Stream (I think) that stated literally no survival rate difference of largemouth bass hooked and released immediately with barbed or barbless hooks.  I’d like to find out more about any studies that may have been done, if you know of any.  Also, I am still going to fish barbless because I know for a fact they’re easier to get out of human skin than the barbed kind!  Ever been hooked in the back by a Big O? Jim Pankey USN (Ret.) “Barbless Bassin’”

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, dipshit, it’s not art, it’s a crime. If you want dead fish, go to a fish market. Oh, and stay the hell out of this newsgroup, loser.

Response:

Disolving Fish Hooks largemouth bass fishing boat

Question:

HELP ME PLEASE I have been told that if hooks are to far down in a fishes mouth, you should cut off and release the fish.largemouth bass fishing boat  The hooks left in the mouth will eventually disolve. Can someone tell me where i can get some info on this?  A friend does not believe me and wants to see written proof.  Please E-mail me at Thanks a lot for the help.

Response:

HELP ME PLEASE I have been told that if hooks are to far down in a fishes mouth, you should cut off and release the fish.  The hooks left in the mouth will eventually disolve. Can someone tell me where i can get some info on this?  A friend does not believe me and wants to see written proof.  Please E-mail me at Thanks a lot for the help. Pete

Pete, Several years ago when I was the fisheries manager for “The Lakes of Danbury” in southeast Texas, we did our own study on hook mortality of leave it vs take it out in largemouth bass.largemouth bass fishing boat  We found out the following and were quite surprised. We had bass fishing club members bring in all deeply hooked bass to holding tanks by the lake.  They brought them in aerated live wells to the tanks which had antibiotic dissolved in the water.  One tank had bass put into it that had had the hook carefully as possible removed.  The other tank had bass with the hook left in and the line cut as close to the hook eye as possible.  BTW, most deeply hooked bass were caught on plastic worms.   The tanks were monitored twice daily and records kept.  80% of the bass that had the hook removed died within 24 hours.  The other 20% were healthy after five days and released back to the lake.largemouth bass fishing boat   20% of the bass with the hooks left in them were dead within 24 hours, the other 80% were healthy after five days.  Some were kept up to two weeks in this group.  Of the fish that survived, 80% had disgorged the hook and it was lying on the bottom of the tank within one to five days. These fish were released back to the lake. The other 20% were either still retaining the hook after two weeks, or passed the hook through thier digestive tracts, usually hanging up in the anus. We found that the hooks did not dissolve in the bass, or in the water. However,largemouth bass fishing boat the hook wound would fester up and the hook would fall out of the fish’s throat in 4 out of 5 cases of surviving fish.  The wound would quickly heal and the fish was fine.  The other case most likely would end up as a delayed mortality through infection, or blockage of the digestive tract.   Bottom line, remove the deeply embedded hook and lose 80% of the fish, leave it and salvage 2/3s of them.  Our rules became that a guest was to leave a deeply embedded hook in the fish and release it. I’m sure different fish and differing situations would require further study.largemouth bass fishing boat  But for our bass in our lakes, fished for by our guests (who had been instructed on how to properly catch and release the fish), leaving the hook in seemed to work best.

Response:

I caught a largemouth during a tournament and had hooked him deep.  I cut the line close to the hook and put the bass in my livewell.largemouth bass fishing boat  I checked him periodically and he seemed to be doing fine.  When we got to the weigh in site, I checked the fish and only the eyelet of the hook was visible, he had swallowed the entire hook. I know that the Bass have a strong acid in their stomach, but how long that hook would last in there I don’t know.

Response:

Florida Largemouth Bass record largemouth bass

Question:

Try both February and March. record largemouth bass

Response:

I would like to know when and where in Florida is the best time to catch a very large fish?record largemouth bass  The one time in your life type trophy.

Response:

I would like to know when and where in Florida is the best time to catch a very large fish?  The one time in your life type trophy.

Response:

I would like to know when and where in Florida is the best time to catch a very large fish?  The one time in your life type trophy.

Response:

I would like to know when and where in Florida is the best time to catch a very large fish?  The one time in your life type trophy.

Where:  Lake Lochloosa   (unexcelled for numbers of 12 to 15 pounders) When:   Mid March How:  record largemouth bass   Live Shiners Lake Lochloosa is situated at the ideal latitude, where Florida-strain bass grow faster than those in Georgia (home of world record), and live longer than those in southern Florida.

Response:

Does Anyone Know of largemouth bass fishing "Georgia Waters for Large Pickerel"

Question:

| | I’ve caught seven largemouth bass over 9 lbs,largemouth bass fishing and one 12 pounder, | nevertheless, I still thrill to 2 to 4lb class chain pickerel.   | I’m originally from New Jersey, which yielded 2 previous world record | pickerel.  I now reside in Georgia,largemouth bass fishing where pickerel knowledge | is extremely rare.  Might someone know of good Georgia waters | for trophy pickerel.  The only 2 waters I’m presently aware of | are Lake Seminole and Suwannee River. |                                           Thanx

Response:

| | I’ve caught seven largemouth bass over 9 lbs, and one 12 pounder, | nevertheless, I still thrill to 2 to 4lb class chain pickerel.   | I’m originally from New Jersey, which yielded 2 previous world record | pickerel.  I now reside in Georgia, where pickerel knowledge | is extremely rare.  Might someone know of good Georgia waters | for trophy pickerel.  The only 2 waters I’m presently aware of | are Lake Seminole and Suwannee River. |                                           Thanx in Advance,   Mark |  Try ClarK Hill Reservoir over by Augusta.

Also lake Richard B. Russell Just north of Clarks Hill outside Elberton David

Response:

Mark, I saw your post and reminisced a little.largemouth bass fishing  When I grew up in South Jersey, pickerel was the gamefish of choice because the bass fishing was pretty poor.  That was the reason I moved to VA. I don’t know about pickerel in GA, but there is some monster pickerel in FL.  I was down there two years ago in Jan and the bass fishing was terrible, but I could not keep the 3 lb. pickerel of my spinnerbait.  It turned an otherwise boring trip into a lot of fun. Chuck – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve caught seven largemouth bass over 9 lbs, and one 12 pounder, nevertheless, I still thrill to 2 to 4lb class chain pickerel.   I’m originally from New Jersey, which yielded 2 previous world record pickerel.largemouth bass fishing  I now reside in Georgia, where pickerel knowledge is extremely rare.  Might someone know of good Georgia waters for trophy pickerel.

Response:

Mark: I’m from Jersey also,largemouth bass fishing Manalapan area, and flyrod for pickerel.  They are great.  Where did you fish? Adam

Response:

I’ve caught seven largemouth bass over 9 lbs, and one 12 pounder, nevertheless, I still thrill to 2 to 4lb class chain pickerel.   I’m originally from New Jersey, which yielded 2 previous world record pickerel.  I now reside in Georgia, where pickerel knowledge is extremely rare.  Might someone know of good Georgia waters for trophy pickerel.  The only 2 waters I’m presently aware of are Lake Seminole and Suwannee River.

Response:

MERRY CHRISTMAS largemouth bass sketches

Question:

MERRY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY 1999 – Neil Cairns.largemouth bass sketches   “Home Rule for Yorkshire”

Response:

MERRY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY 1999

Ditto. Daniel Vesma www.thewebtree.com www.thewebtree.com/daniel-vesma

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  largemouth bass sketches   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of largemouth bass sketches this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced..largemouth bass sketches. Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”     Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  /()   ^^   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  /()   ^^   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  /()   ^^   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  /()   ^^   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  /()   ^^   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

O< “Best wishes to you too Dave!”  /()   ^^   Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!!   The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                   Best Wishes,                                                              Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave

Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

happy end of the year to all!!! fred

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                Best Wishes,                                                           Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!! The Closest Thing I’ve Got To An Official Web Site: http://www.noteworthymusic.net/otf.htm ** Change “.nospam” to “.com” to send an email :-) **

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced…                                                 Best Wishes,                                                            Dave

Response:

Merry Christmas to all my fellow merry bass elf brothers!! The one day of the year our G.A.S. is not self-induced… Best Wishes, Dave Same to you Dave, and to the rest of this great group of guys and gals…. Merry Christmas!!!!!!

Ok, Daves nick brings up a good question…Why ain’t there no largemouth bass BASS?  (or even a smallie?)

Response:

Merry Christmas everyone!!  (Prozac must be kicking in!!)  Anyway, for all of those that are alone this Christmas, I wish you well, and I will be thinking of you.  The boards have been a great source for me and I want everyone to know that I appreciate their stories, pain, frustration, humor, and sometimes a little happiness.       Have a great holiday! (:-)  Veronica

Response:

Have a great holiday! (:-)  Veronica

snipped. Same to you Veronica :) — —– … Something Deep!

Response:

Veronica, And a very merry Christmas to you too! – Jo