Question:

worlds largest largemouth bass No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Frank Not to push any of the other replies aside, but in the koi pond world when there is a fish loss and the largest fish affected,worlds largest largemouth bass it’s usually fair to say it was an O2 problem.

I would not over look the possibility of lethal gas build up either. (would also effect bigger fish first) Especially considering the fact of an ice cap which would contain or trap them. Kind of hand in hand with Jan’s idea. If a pond is un able to receive a free 02 exchange,worlds largest largemouth bass  it would be impossible for it to dispel or gas off undesirable N-Compounds.

Response:

No I did not fish the pond after late summer.worlds largest largemouth bass I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had.

Not to push any of the other replies aside, but in the koi pond world when there is a fish loss and the largest fish affected,worlds largest largemouth bass it’s usually fair to say it was an O2 problem.

Response:

Hi, Frank!     We’re mostly catch and release, but keep a few for the pan.     Turtles are showing up in the ponds again, so I guess they’ll keep us busy clearing them out for a while.  I hate feeding them!  (Ducklings, goslings, fish, etc.) Kathleen

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Frank!     Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject. Kathleen Hi Kathleen    No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Thanks for the concern Frank So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy. Before you buy. Before you buy.

Response:

[and, fortunately, corrected the following stupid error I made in a previous post]: [snip] So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen….[snip] Ok, couple of problems… First, cold water dissolves *more* gas than warm water, by a fairly large factor…I do agree though that it is the wave action that makes a difference.

[snip] OOPS.  Yes, by all accounts and measures (and according to “Water Quality in Ponds for Aquaculture,” by Claude Boyd), cold water holds MORE dissolved oxygen than warm water.  I had it backwards, as was pointed out by “ck” and by another gentleman who emailed me a note. Thanks for the correction. C. Brunner

Response:

Hi, Frank!     Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject. Kathleen

Hi Kathleen    No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Thanks for the concern Frank – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy. Before you buy.

Before you buy.

Response:

Hi, Frank!     Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject. Kathleen

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy. Before you buy.

Response:

Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject.

I suspect that bit about catch and release being bad.  Sure I have heard the same thing over the years, but mostly heard that from those who do not fish and/or do not like fishing.   I am a catch and release person from since I was a kid.  Not only have I caught and released, but I have experienced recatching quite a few that I released from having caught earlier….  I keep a log of fish caught and game I have hunted, and so I know that have recaught many over and over and over again.   Personally, my experience is that most often people stock too heavily all at once, which causes several stresses on the waters and the stockings, and anyone who has ever done so with an aquarium knows that is a fact.   It could also be a water quality issue due to changes in the climate, it could also be too many food fishes (usually sunny overpopulation) and not enough main preditors to keep the food fishes from overpopulating the waters. — BulkMailers and Email address compilers may purchase this individual email address for $25000.00 for use in their products. Anyone selling this email address or utilizing this email address for any commercial usage without a license from ShadowMAC is in violation of private property rights and violators WILL be be invoiced for usage. Selling what you do not own is THEFT of private property!!! This is domain policy. http://shadowmac.org/license_schedule.html

Response:

So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond.

Ok, couple of problems… First, cold water dissolves *more* gas than warm water, by a fairly large factor…I do agree though that it is the wave action that makes a difference. Second, if there is significant ice cover as well as the shade on the pond, then the plants and algae could have died back as well, increasing the biological oxygen demand….and decreasing the available oxygen in the pond. I also agree that getting the extension agent to evaluate the pond and the fish load. Among other things, fish under population stress actually mature at a *smaller size* than fish which are not…this means that you could have a situation where you don’t even have “legal sized” fish to remove with a hook and line. In situations like this, the fish load can be reduced with the use of seine nets, fish poison or electrifiers. If every thing else checks out, and your pond is not infected or over stocked, then one option that might be available in your area would be to use a small pump to make a fountain off to one side of your pond. The circulation would help prevent that area from freezing and provide more oxygenation. ck — Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP,Member,PGBFH,KC5EVN Email address dump file for spam: reply to ckrin at Iamerica dot net F*S=k (Freedom times Security equals a constant: the more security you have, the less freedom! Niven’s Fourth Law)

Response:

…Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water

just a trivia note: Cold water can hold MORE oxygen than warm water, if it’s aerated. Saturation solubility of oxygen in fresh water vs temperature:  0 C  32 F  14.6 mg/l or ppm 10 C  50 F  11.3 20 C  68 F   9.1 30 C  86 F   7.5 40 C  104 F  6.4 Here’s a graph: http://home.pacbell.net/normeck/H2oQual.html#DISSOLVED_OXYGEN and here’s a calculator http://ag.ansc.purdue.edu/aquanic/images/tools/oxygen.htm Also, biological oxygen demand goes up with strongly with temperature. So lack of oxygen is primarily a midsummer concern. Cold water can also hold more carbon dioxide than warm water. Build up of CO2 under the ice can be a wintertime concern. Aeration is the answer, both in summer and winter. – Rod

Response:

I had the same problem in ‘93. Extension lady said it was due to too many grass carp ( White Amur) . When I pu them in my pond  it was pretty weed choked.  They grew to huge sizes and ate too much of the vegatation, thereby depleting the oxygen producing capability of the pond.  Combined with an unusually long term ice cover that winter it rersulted in killing pretty much all of the pond.  I restocked the next spring and left the grass carp out.  Weeds are getting out of hand again, so I plan to release only 2 or 3 Amurs this time and when the weeds look to be depleted again I will net the Amurs and get them out. Mike B

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all    I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

Hi,         I live on the eastern end of Long Island and up to two weeks ago I still had a small ice berg floating in the middle of my pond. It could have been caused if the pond was iced over for extened period of time or rotting debris at the bottom of the pond it’s. This was the coldest winter I remmember in a long time but I ran my BIO-FALLS and skimmer all winter and had no fish kill. Visit my pond any time I live right off Exist 63 Long Island Expressway.          Happy Ponding,         Bullfrog-ed         Aquascape Designs Ecosystem         Pro Pond Kits         http://www.pondguys.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all    I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking.

Quiite true.   It is always better to understock a pond and let it grow slowly over a couple of years, than it is to slam it full of fish.   Not to mention that you have other effects than just merely die off due to not enough O2 for the amount of fish in the pond, but also to allow bacteria and plants to slowly grow with the pond to deal with the fishes excrement and such.   Also, it is a better idea to stock the smaller fish in the first year, then stock whatever preditor fish the 2nd year.  Allow the food fishes to gain a good hold on the pond and build the population of food fishes up to the point that a pond can then support larger preditor fish.   Personally, my ponds are stocked along a three year plan. — BulkMailers and Email address compilers may purchase this individual email address for $25000.00 for use in their products. Anyone selling this email address or utilizing this email address for any commercial usage without a license from ShadowMAC is in violation of private property rights and violators WILL be be invoiced for usage. Selling what you do not own is THEFT of private property!!! This is domain policy. http://shadowmac.org/license_schedule.html

Response:

So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond?

The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert.

I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Before you buy.

Response:

OK, first of all, you should be calling your county agricultural extension agent or the extension division of the nearest land-grant institution in your state (Cornell?).  Or call your state fisheries biologist.  Somebody trained in fish disease diagnosis might be able to find out what killed your fish by examining them and their habitat. But you’ve asked us instead….  So, let’s give it a try.  First, let’s do some math: 70 yd = 210 ft;  25 yd = 75 ft. So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. That’s around a third of an acre–not very much.  (I can never remember the square feet in an acre, so I had to back-calculate it from 640 acres = 1 “section” = 5,280 ft x 5,280 ft.)  Incidentally, although it seems like you ought to be able to consider the “volume” of the pond when stocking fish, the depth turns out to be almost meaningless.  The limiting factor is the surface area, because that’s what determines how much oxygen is absorbed from the air. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. But, after all this, I have no clue.  Sure, maybe the pond is stocked too heavily.  That would be a likely explanation.  Or, maybe the water temperature stratified and the pond froze over and there’s nothing that could have changed the situation except installing an emergency aerator.  That’s practical here in the SE, where ice doesn’t last overnight.  But in NY?  Or, maybe your fish died of Largemouth Bass Virus (which has not yet been reported in New York OR in the winter months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. C. Brunner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

I thought my goldfish had had it. Very shallow and very frozen Upon the thaw they are bigger and better How is this possible?

Response:

I thought my goldfish had had it. Very shallow and very frozen Upon the thaw they are bigger and better How is this possible?

There have been claims of goldfish surviving actually being frozen… The bigger part surprised me.  Previously I’ve just had goldfish and one was just like the next, so I never really noticed them growing. Last year I was given 9 koi, and the little one has _definitely_ grown over the winter.  Or at least he’s bigger than my memory from November — Derek (www.netcom.ca/~dbrought/pond) rec.ponds FAQ  http://w3.one.net/~rzutt/faq.html Good research is *always* profitable.  - Heinlein

Response:

Hi all    I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Frank Not to push any of the other replies aside, but in the koi pond world when there is a fish loss and the largest fish affected, it’s usually fair to say it was an O2 problem. ~ jan

I would not over look the possibility of lethal gas build up either. (would also effect bigger fish first) Especially considering the fact of an ice cap which would contain or trap them. Kind of hand in hand with Jan’s idea. If a pond is un able to receive a free 02 exchange, it would be impossible for it to dispel or gas off undesirable N-Compounds….. — Charles K. Anderson http://www.pondguy.com CSA Bacteria and Enzymes C&S Biological Filter System

Response:

No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Frank

Not to push any of the other replies aside, but in the koi pond world when there is a fish loss and the largest fish affected, it’s usually fair to say it was an O2 problem. ~ jan See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design: http://users.owt.com/jjspond/          ~Keep ‘em Thawed~       Tri-Cities, WA    Zone 7a          To e-mail see website

Response:

Hi, Frank!     We’re mostly catch and release, but keep a few for the pan.     Turtles are showing up in the ponds again, so I guess they’ll keep us busy clearing them out for a while.  I hate feeding them!  (Ducklings, goslings, fish, etc.) Kathleen

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Frank!     Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject. Kathleen Hi Kathleen    No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Thanks for the concern Frank So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy. Before you buy. Before you buy.

Response:

[and, fortunately, corrected the following stupid error I made in a previous post]: [snip] So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen….[snip] Ok, couple of problems… First, cold water dissolves *more* gas than warm water, by a fairly large factor…I do agree though that it is the wave action that makes a difference.

[snip] OOPS.  Yes, by all accounts and measures (and according to “Water Quality in Ponds for Aquaculture,” by Claude Boyd), cold water holds MORE dissolved oxygen than warm water.  I had it backwards, as was pointed out by “ck” and by another gentleman who emailed me a note. Thanks for the correction. C. Brunner

Response:

Hi, Frank!     Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject. Kathleen

Hi Kathleen    No I did not fish the pond after late summer. I live in Central NY. People do ice fish but usually on small lakes and the big lakes if they freeze over. I enjoyed watching the bass and once a week or so I would get out a pole and give them some exercise. I was hoping some of them would get really big. 5-6 lbs or more. I dont think they all died but I had put two years of work into growing them and the loss will hurt the plans I had. Thanks for the concern Frank – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy. Before you buy.

Before you buy.

Response:

Hi, Frank!     Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject. Kathleen

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy. Before you buy.

Response:

Having read several (conflicting) articles on catch and release, I wonder if that could also contribute to your fish deaths.  Some believe that these fish eventually succumb to the injuries incurred while on the hook.     So, did you fish during the Winter?  If not, then this is obviously not an issue.     Just another slant on the subject.

I suspect that bit about catch and release being bad.  Sure I have heard the same thing over the years, but mostly heard that from those who do not fish and/or do not like fishing.   I am a catch and release person from since I was a kid.  Not only have I caught and released, but I have experienced recatching quite a few that I released from having caught earlier….  I keep a log of fish caught and game I have hunted, and so I know that have recaught many over and over and over again.   Personally, my experience is that most often people stock too heavily all at once, which causes several stresses on the waters and the stockings, and anyone who has ever done so with an aquarium knows that is a fact.   It could also be a water quality issue due to changes in the climate, it could also be too many food fishes (usually sunny overpopulation) and not enough main preditors to keep the food fishes from overpopulating the waters. — BulkMailers and Email address compilers may purchase this individual email address for $25000.00 for use in their products. Anyone selling this email address or utilizing this email address for any commercial usage without a license from ShadowMAC is in violation of private property rights and violators WILL be be invoiced for usage. Selling what you do not own is THEFT of private property!!! This is domain policy. http://shadowmac.org/license_schedule.html

Response:

So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond.

Ok, couple of problems… First, cold water dissolves *more* gas than warm water, by a fairly large factor…I do agree though that it is the wave action that makes a difference. Second, if there is significant ice cover as well as the shade on the pond, then the plants and algae could have died back as well, increasing the biological oxygen demand….and decreasing the available oxygen in the pond. I also agree that getting the extension agent to evaluate the pond and the fish load. Among other things, fish under population stress actually mature at a *smaller size* than fish which are not…this means that you could have a situation where you don’t even have “legal sized” fish to remove with a hook and line. In situations like this, the fish load can be reduced with the use of seine nets, fish poison or electrifiers. If every thing else checks out, and your pond is not infected or over stocked, then one option that might be available in your area would be to use a small pump to make a fountain off to one side of your pond. The circulation would help prevent that area from freezing and provide more oxygenation. ck — Charles S. Krin, DO FAAFP,Member,PGBFH,KC5EVN Email address dump file for spam: reply to ckrin at Iamerica dot net F*S=k (Freedom times Security equals a constant: the more security you have, the less freedom! Niven’s Fourth Law)

Response:

…Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water

just a trivia note: Cold water can hold MORE oxygen than warm water, if it’s aerated. Saturation solubility of oxygen in fresh water vs temperature:  0 C  32 F  14.6 mg/l or ppm 10 C  50 F  11.3 20 C  68 F   9.1 30 C  86 F   7.5 40 C  104 F  6.4 Here’s a graph: http://home.pacbell.net/normeck/H2oQual.html#DISSOLVED_OXYGEN and here’s a calculator http://ag.ansc.purdue.edu/aquanic/images/tools/oxygen.htm Also, biological oxygen demand goes up with strongly with temperature. So lack of oxygen is primarily a midsummer concern. Cold water can also hold more carbon dioxide than warm water. Build up of CO2 under the ice can be a wintertime concern. Aeration is the answer, both in summer and winter. – Rod

Response:

I had the same problem in ‘93. Extension lady said it was due to too many grass carp ( White Amur) . When I pu them in my pond  it was pretty weed choked.  They grew to huge sizes and ate too much of the vegatation, thereby depleting the oxygen producing capability of the pond.  Combined with an unusually long term ice cover that winter it rersulted in killing pretty much all of the pond.  I restocked the next spring and left the grass carp out.  Weeds are getting out of hand again, so I plan to release only 2 or 3 Amurs this time and when the weeds look to be depleted again I will net the Amurs and get them out. Mike B

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all    I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

Hi,         I live on the eastern end of Long Island and up to two weeks ago I still had a small ice berg floating in the middle of my pond. It could have been caused if the pond was iced over for extened period of time or rotting debris at the bottom of the pond it’s. This was the coldest winter I remmember in a long time but I ran my BIO-FALLS and skimmer all winter and had no fish kill. Visit my pond any time I live right off Exist 63 Long Island Expressway.          Happy Ponding,         Bullfrog-ed         Aquascape Designs Ecosystem         Pro Pond Kits         http://www.pondguys.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all    I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking.

Quiite true.   It is always better to understock a pond and let it grow slowly over a couple of years, than it is to slam it full of fish.   Not to mention that you have other effects than just merely die off due to not enough O2 for the amount of fish in the pond, but also to allow bacteria and plants to slowly grow with the pond to deal with the fishes excrement and such.   Also, it is a better idea to stock the smaller fish in the first year, then stock whatever preditor fish the 2nd year.  Allow the food fishes to gain a good hold on the pond and build the population of food fishes up to the point that a pond can then support larger preditor fish.   Personally, my ponds are stocked along a three year plan. — BulkMailers and Email address compilers may purchase this individual email address for $25000.00 for use in their products. Anyone selling this email address or utilizing this email address for any commercial usage without a license from ShadowMAC is in violation of private property rights and violators WILL be be invoiced for usage. Selling what you do not own is THEFT of private property!!! This is domain policy. http://shadowmac.org/license_schedule.html

Response:

So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond?

The first year I put in 6 breeder bass( in excess of 12″) 8 8″ bass and 30 3″. Maybe a dozen sunfish. 1/2 dozen bullheads and all the minnows weekly left over from fishing trips to lakes. I would say most of the adult fish spawned at least once because I would see nests and lots of bass and sunfish minnows. I didn’t take any of the bass out but did practice catch and release. It sure hurt to see bass 14″ + dead in the water. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert.

I’ll try to follow up on that. Thing is most of those places are 9-5 Monday thru Fri and I dont get home and done with chores til 6:30. Thanks so much for the input. Maybe this year I’ll be sure to cut down on the amount of fish to winter because like I said before I lost no fish the previous winters and this winter the pond thawed earlier than the previous two. Thanks again. Frank – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – C. Brunner Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Before you buy.

Response:

OK, first of all, you should be calling your county agricultural extension agent or the extension division of the nearest land-grant institution in your state (Cornell?).  Or call your state fisheries biologist.  Somebody trained in fish disease diagnosis might be able to find out what killed your fish by examining them and their habitat. But you’ve asked us instead….  So, let’s give it a try.  First, let’s do some math: 70 yd = 210 ft;  25 yd = 75 ft. So, the surface area of your pond is 210 x 75 = 15,750 s.f. That’s around a third of an acre–not very much.  (I can never remember the square feet in an acre, so I had to back-calculate it from 640 acres = 1 “section” = 5,280 ft x 5,280 ft.)  Incidentally, although it seems like you ought to be able to consider the “volume” of the pond when stocking fish, the depth turns out to be almost meaningless.  The limiting factor is the surface area, because that’s what determines how much oxygen is absorbed from the air. Now, how many fish did you say you stocked in this 1/3-acre pond? And, how many of them have survived and reproduced in the 2 years since then?  I know zip about proper stocking densities, but I have heard that the most common problem with back-yard and farm ponds is over-stocking. So, this winter you’ve lost some fish.  Not very many (15?), unless you only put in a few dozen in the first place.  ”Winter kill” occurs when the dissolved oxygen drops below a tolerable level and the fish suffocate.  Cold water holds less oxygen than warm water, and water that’s trapped beneath ice doesn’t get turned over by wave action to dissolve more air/oxygen.  I don’t know if shade matters where you live, unless the plants and algae usually survive through the winter and continue to photosynthesize despite the cold temperatures.  If so, then the situation is made worse by shading of the pond. But, after all this, I have no clue.  Sure, maybe the pond is stocked too heavily.  That would be a likely explanation.  Or, maybe the water temperature stratified and the pond froze over and there’s nothing that could have changed the situation except installing an emergency aerator.  That’s practical here in the SE, where ice doesn’t last overnight.  But in NY?  Or, maybe your fish died of Largemouth Bass Virus (which has not yet been reported in New York OR in the winter months).  I’m always recommending that people with sick animals CALL THE VET.  In your case, I think you should call a fish disease/fisheries biology expert. C. Brunner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all   I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

I thought my goldfish had had it. Very shallow and very frozen Upon the thaw they are bigger and better How is this possible?

Response:

I thought my goldfish had had it. Very shallow and very frozen Upon the thaw they are bigger and better How is this possible?

There have been claims of goldfish surviving actually being frozen… The bigger part surprised me.  Previously I’ve just had goldfish and one was just like the next, so I never really noticed them growing. Last year I was given 9 koi, and the little one has _definitely_ grown over the winter.  Or at least he’s bigger than my memory from November — Derek (www.netcom.ca/~dbrought/pond) rec.ponds FAQ  http://w3.one.net/~rzutt/faq.html Good research is *always* profitable.  - Heinlein

Response:

Hi all    I have a pond that is about 70 yds long by 25 yds wide. It is more than 10 feet deep in the deepest spots. I put and assortment of fish (largemouth bass, shiners, sunfish, crappies) in it in the spring of 98. For two winters I saw no dead fish in the spring when the ice melted. This year I saw at least 15. I have no idea how many others died. I lived in Central NY. Other ponds have been ice free for a few weeks. Mine is just starting. I would guess because half of it is shaded with trees. Does anyone have any ideas? Could it be that I have too many fish? Should I have cut a hole in the center of the ice? I dont do any sort of chemical treatment so in the summer there are weeds around the shallower areas. Any input would be most appreciated. Thanks Frank Before you buy.

Response:

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